Nick Jackson and Sarah Mahan recently embarked on a transformative journey from Atkinson, Maine, to Healy, Kansas, to pursue regenerative agriculture. Their passion for soil health and sustainable farming practices led them to transition from market gardening to livestock farming. With backgrounds in organic agriculture and compost production, they have drawn inspiration from influential thinkers like Alan Savory to enhance their approach to farming. Their story is not just about agriculture but also about personal growth, community support, and family dynamics as they navigate their new life in Kansas.
Topics covered in this episode:
- Introduction to regenerative agriculture and Nick and Sarah's background
- Transition from market gardening to livestock farming
- Influence of thinkers like Alan Savory on their practices
- Historical and ecological evolution of agriculture in Maine
- Challenges and emotional aspects of relocating from Maine to Kansas
- Managing livestock in a new environment and adapting to local conditions
- Experiences with flash floods and community support
- Insights into grazing strategies and sustainable farming techniques
- Family dynamics and working with loved ones in a farming context
Listeners should tune in to this podcast episode to gain a comprehensive understanding of regenerative agriculture through the real-life experiences of Nick and Sarah. Their journey is both inspiring and educational, offering practical insights into sustainable farming practices and the resilience required to adapt to new environments. Whether you're an established farmer or someone new to the field, their story provides valuable lessons in managing cash flow, embracing change, and maintaining a sustainable lifestyle. The episode also offers a rich tapestry of historical and ecological perspectives, making it a must-listen for anyone interested in the intersection of agriculture, sustainability, and personal growth.
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Original Music by Louis Palfrey
Chapters
- (00:00) - Introduction and Fast Five
- (00:50) - Welcome to the Grazing Grass Podcast
- (01:25) - Noble Research Institute Courses
- (02:28) - Starting the Regenerative Journey
- (06:01) - Transitioning to Livestock
- (08:34) - Challenges and Strategies in Farming
- (17:15) - Maine's Agricultural Landscape
- (25:57) - Moving to Kansas: A New Beginning
- (42:37) - Airbnb Adventures and Meeting Greg
- (43:59) - Selling Everything and Moving to Kansas
- (45:37) - Challenges and Changes in Kansas
- (48:45) - Custom Grazing and Scaling Up
- (52:15) - Managing Sheep and Steers
- (01:04:47) - Favorite Resources and Tools
- (01:09:51) - Working with Family and Final Thoughts
NOTE This file was generated by Descript
00:00:00 --> 00:00:02 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: We will get started with the fast five.
00:00:02 --> 00:00:03 What's your name?
00:00:03 --> 00:00:05 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Nick Jackson and Sarah Mayhem.
00:00:06 --> 00:00:08 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: ANd what's your farm's name
00:00:08 --> 00:00:11 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: We currently work for regen, LLC,
00:00:11 --> 00:00:12 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: and where are you located?
00:00:13 --> 00:00:14 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Healy, Kansas.
00:00:15 --> 00:00:17 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: And that's a pretty recent move.
00:00:17 --> 00:00:18 Where'd you move from?
00:00:18 --> 00:00:20 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: We moved from Central Maine,
00:00:20 --> 00:00:21 a town called Atkinson, Maine.
00:00:24 --> 00:00:25 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: So quite a move there.
00:00:25 --> 00:00:26 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: It was,
00:00:26 --> 00:00:27 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:00:27 --> 00:00:29 What livestock species do you graze?
00:00:30 --> 00:00:33 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Sheep and stockers cattle.
00:00:33 --> 00:00:34 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:00:34 --> 00:00:37 And when did you start grazing animals?
00:00:38 --> 00:00:42 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: We started with chickens in like 2015
00:00:43 --> 00:00:43 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:00:44 --> 00:00:46 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Started with sheep in 2018.
00:00:47 --> 00:00:48 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, very good.
00:00:50 --> 00:00:52 Cal: Welcome to the grazing grass podcast.
00:00:52 --> 00:00:55 The podcast dedicated to sharing the stories of grass-based
00:00:55 --> 00:00:59 livestock producers, exploring regenerative practices that improve
00:00:59 --> 00:01:02 the land animals and our lives.
00:01:02 --> 00:01:06 I'm your host, Cal Hardage and each week we'll dive into the journeys,
00:01:06 --> 00:01:11 challenges, and successes of producers like you, learning from
00:01:11 --> 00:01:16 their experiences, and inspiring each other to grow, and graze better.
00:01:17 --> 00:01:21 Whether you're a seasoned grazier or just getting started.
00:01:21 --> 00:01:23 This is the place for you.
00:01:24 --> 00:01:25 Speaker 4: Calling our ranchers.
00:01:25 --> 00:01:29 If you're looking to optimize your grazing operation and boost your bottom
00:01:29 --> 00:01:34 line, Noble Research Institute can help the noble approach to education
00:01:34 --> 00:01:39 pairs their own infield research with the expertise of ranch managers
00:01:39 --> 00:01:44 and advisors to find practical solutions to your unique challenges.
00:01:45 --> 00:01:49 Now's the time to register for one other June in-person courses.
00:01:49 --> 00:01:56 Noble will be in Jefferson City for Noble Grazing Essentials, June 4th through sixth
00:01:57 --> 00:02:04 in Kansas City for Noble Profitability Essentials, June 11th through 12th, and
00:02:04 --> 00:02:10 in Fredericksburg, Texas for Business of Grazing, June 24th through 26th.
00:02:11 --> 00:02:16 Noble Research Institute ensures that every insight they share has been tested
00:02:16 --> 00:02:21 in real world conditions, giving you solutions that work, not just theories.
00:02:22 --> 00:02:23 Visit noble.org
00:02:23 --> 00:02:27 today to learn more about these courses or to register.
00:02:29 --> 00:02:31 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: So let's talk about your regenerative
00:02:31 --> 00:02:33 journey just to get started.
00:02:33 --> 00:02:39 When did you get interested in regenerative ag and has ag always
00:02:39 --> 00:02:42 been in your life, always been something that's been important to you?
00:02:42 --> 00:02:44 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: It, I, I had always wanted to farm,
00:02:44 --> 00:02:49 like from a pretty young age and didn't quite know how to get into it.
00:02:49 --> 00:02:56 I, it was like 2000, oh, well, I don't remember.
00:02:56 --> 00:03:02 I was about 30, so about 15 years ago I started working at Vermont Compost Company
00:03:02 --> 00:03:06 and at the same, the same week I started working at Vermont Compost Company.
00:03:06 --> 00:03:09 Started dating Sarah and I.
00:03:10 --> 00:03:15 We were very interested in organic agriculture and market gardening
00:03:15 --> 00:03:20 at first was kind of where what we being involved in potting soil
00:03:20 --> 00:03:21 production and compost making.
00:03:22 --> 00:03:22 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes,
00:03:22 --> 00:03:24 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: we thought we would do
00:03:24 --> 00:03:26 market gardening for a while.
00:03:26 --> 00:03:30 We had a small market garden and was listening to different
00:03:30 --> 00:03:36 podcasts about, you know, going beyond organic and how you could be
00:03:36 --> 00:03:38 organic and still be degenerative.
00:03:39 --> 00:03:46 And then we started in probably around 2013 or so, we started
00:03:46 --> 00:03:48 hearing about regenerative ag stuff.
00:03:48 --> 00:03:54 And and that's when, you know, started dreaming of getting quitting
00:03:54 --> 00:03:59 the job at Vermont Compost and starting our own, our own farm.
00:04:01 --> 00:04:03 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Sarah has Z always been a interest of yours.
00:04:05 --> 00:04:07 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Well, I grew up in the country mostly,
00:04:07 --> 00:04:14 and definitely wanted to be, have access to animals and things like that.
00:04:14 --> 00:04:19 When I got older, in my twenties, I worked at a biodynamic farm where we
00:04:19 --> 00:04:23 milked cows and raised chickens, and I was actually vegetarian at the time,
00:04:24 --> 00:04:24 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:04:25 --> 00:04:27 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: being around animals and I don't
00:04:27 --> 00:04:32 know, doing it myself, I felt really good about starting to eat meat and
00:04:33 --> 00:04:35 drink milk and all those things again.
00:04:35 --> 00:04:38 And my, actually, my health increased after doing that.
00:04:38 --> 00:04:39 So I was very
00:04:39 --> 00:04:42 grateful for my intuition, just pushing me over the edge of like, oh,
00:04:42 --> 00:04:45 I raised this chicken, we butchered it ourselves and now we're going to eat it.
00:04:45 --> 00:04:47 It's really a good process.
00:04:47 --> 00:04:50 So, kind of coming full circle on that and.
00:04:50 --> 00:04:55 Just really appreciating all the things I've learned with the little,
00:04:55 --> 00:04:57 the little steps into agriculture.
00:04:57 --> 00:05:01 But neither Nick nor I have a farming ranching background.
00:05:01 --> 00:05:04 So that's also a blessing and a curse on its own because we
00:05:04 --> 00:05:09 get to learn all fresh and teach it to ourselves or find mentors.
00:05:09 --> 00:05:12 But but we didn't come with the innate skills of that.
00:05:13 --> 00:05:13 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:05:13 --> 00:05:16 Or, or the paradigms that you all have to shift.
00:05:16 --> 00:05:20 So, you know, it's, we often talk about our unfair advantage
00:05:20 --> 00:05:22 or our unfair disadvantage.
00:05:22 --> 00:05:23 We've all got 'em.
00:05:23 --> 00:05:27 So I don't know which, depending on the day you would put that as
00:05:27 --> 00:05:29 a advantage and a different day.
00:05:29 --> 00:05:30 You might put it as a disadvantage.
00:05:31 --> 00:05:31 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: right.
00:05:32 --> 00:05:32 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:05:33 --> 00:05:35 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Early on, we were very interested in that
00:05:35 --> 00:05:40 concept of our unfair advantage, and that was part of what, like thinking about our
00:05:40 --> 00:05:43 unfair advantages was what gave us the.
00:05:44 --> 00:05:49 The courage to leave the job and try to start our own, our own operation.
00:05:50 --> 00:05:50 Yeah.
00:05:51 --> 00:05:51 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yes.
00:05:52 --> 00:05:57 When, when you all y'all were associated with compost and working with that,
00:05:57 --> 00:06:00 and you talked about your market garden, you got started in that.
00:06:01 --> 00:06:04 What caused you to make that next step to livestock?
00:06:05 --> 00:06:09 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Well, we're very interested in soil
00:06:10 --> 00:06:14 health and at the compost company it was always like, well, you know,
00:06:14 --> 00:06:19 you're, it was a lot of importation of ingredients for making the compost.
00:06:19 --> 00:06:24 And we noticed that all of the compost was coming from conventional ag
00:06:24 --> 00:06:25 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yeah.
00:06:26 --> 00:06:27 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: To make an organic, a
00:06:27 --> 00:06:29 certified organic potting mix.
00:06:29 --> 00:06:34 So, you know, basically when we started our own, we wanted to have more control
00:06:34 --> 00:06:37 over the manure that we were gonna make compost with for our market garden.
00:06:38 --> 00:06:44 And, and we started thinking more about, you know, using livestocks
00:06:44 --> 00:06:47 livestock as a tool to improve soil.
00:06:47 --> 00:06:54 And honestly, our focus went away from the food production to the soil
00:06:54 --> 00:06:57 rehabilitation and, and and building soil.
00:06:57 --> 00:07:02 And I started listening to, you know, stuff like Alan Savory and, and,
00:07:02 --> 00:07:07 just, it broadened my perspective from thinking about like doing, I
00:07:07 --> 00:07:10 was very focused on like, oh, what's the smallest market garden we could
00:07:10 --> 00:07:16 have and be profitable and, you know, pay ourselves to what's the largest
00:07:16 --> 00:07:18 amount of acreage we could improve.
00:07:18 --> 00:07:19 You know, it was
00:07:19 --> 00:07:19 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:07:20 --> 00:07:22 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And so, you know, trying to be part
00:07:22 --> 00:07:27 of that bigger, that bigger goal of not just making a living, but slowing
00:07:27 --> 00:07:32 down desertification and, and, and proving soils around the, you know, in
00:07:32 --> 00:07:34 the biggest area we could conceive of.
00:07:34 --> 00:07:40 So it was a, it was, you know, it took a few years tr tra tradi transition.
00:07:40 --> 00:07:43 I think at first Sarah was a little more like you wanted to just do
00:07:43 --> 00:07:46 like the small scale thing, and I was like, no, we need to have like
00:07:46 --> 00:07:48 a, you know, a thousand acre farm.
00:07:48 --> 00:07:52 And, and but she, you know, I think really, I mean at the same time he was
00:07:52 --> 00:07:54 studying like soil health and stuff.
00:07:54 --> 00:07:57 I was studying nutrition after being, like I said, vegetarian
00:07:57 --> 00:08:01 and then starting to eat meat again and wanting to grow
00:08:01 --> 00:08:03 the best meat that we could.
00:08:03 --> 00:08:07 So we started getting into chickens and pigs at least because you could,
00:08:07 --> 00:08:09 because you could turn a profit.
00:08:09 --> 00:08:13 Quickly on those, you know, a cow takes a certain number of years to grow out.
00:08:13 --> 00:08:14 It's a big investment.
00:08:14 --> 00:08:19 And so how did we, we stepped up through pigs and chickens and eggs and and then
00:08:19 --> 00:08:23 lamb, because we could also buy those in, in the spring and finish them in the fall.
00:08:23 --> 00:08:25 So it was a, it was an interesting journey.
00:08:25 --> 00:08:29 We just kind of kept taking that next step to, and then finally
00:08:29 --> 00:08:32 getting beef into our operation.
00:08:32 --> 00:08:32 Yeah.
00:08:33 --> 00:08:33 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:08:34 --> 00:08:36 And Sarah, you bring up an important point there.
00:08:36 --> 00:08:40 When we're thinking about profitability and turning money over, chickens
00:08:40 --> 00:08:45 have a much shorter timeframe for that happening versus other species.
00:08:46 --> 00:08:47 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And that's, that's what we were doing
00:08:47 --> 00:08:52 there in Maine was we started with like a Joel model of like, give away
00:08:52 --> 00:08:56 your first, like the first batch of chickens, just give them away to people
00:08:56 --> 00:08:57 that you think might be interested.
00:08:57 --> 00:09:02 And very quickly we had, you know, we sold out all of our chickens, so it was,
00:09:02 --> 00:09:06 it was a pre pre-buy program where people had to put up the money
00:09:06 --> 00:09:11 up front, which gave us the, the money to buy the chicks and all the
00:09:11 --> 00:09:13 grain and to feed them and, right.
00:09:13 --> 00:09:17 And I was, we were moving the chickens every day in little chicken tractors.
00:09:17 --> 00:09:20 And I was, you know, doing that imagining, you know, someday these
00:09:20 --> 00:09:22 will be cattle, this you'll be,
00:09:22 --> 00:09:22 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh
00:09:23 --> 00:09:23 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: not, not, not,
00:09:23 --> 00:09:24 chickens.
00:09:24 --> 00:09:28 And, and it's, it's cool 'cause it's kind of come, it's come to that,
00:09:28 --> 00:09:28 right?
00:09:28 --> 00:09:29 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: yeah.
00:09:29 --> 00:09:29 Very good.
00:09:30 --> 00:09:35 Now I wanna dive a little bit into that pre they've got pre-buy it,
00:09:35 --> 00:09:39 so do you sell it to 'em based upon the next batch of chickens you did.
00:09:40 --> 00:09:42 And you hadn't ordered any of your chicks at that point?
00:09:43 --> 00:09:45 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: So I forget when we first started out, but by
00:09:45 --> 00:09:50 the end we were doing like a January sale if you bought in in January, which let us
00:09:50 --> 00:09:53 make sure we could plan how many chickens.
00:09:53 --> 00:09:55 I think actually the last time we did the chickens, we, it was
00:09:55 --> 00:09:57 like November, November, October.
00:09:57 --> 00:09:58 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yes.
00:09:58 --> 00:09:59 It just keep, yeah.
00:09:59 --> 00:10:00 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: because we won like, Hey, did
00:10:00 --> 00:10:02 you like our chickens this year?
00:10:02 --> 00:10:04 Do you wanna reinvest?
00:10:04 --> 00:10:05 And I would send out an email.
00:10:05 --> 00:10:08 Email, don't think we asked for money in November, but we asked for people
00:10:08 --> 00:10:10 to make a promise that they were gonna buy chickens with us again,
00:10:11 --> 00:10:11 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, okay.
00:10:12 --> 00:10:13 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: in January.
00:10:13 --> 00:10:14 And so that gave
00:10:14 --> 00:10:17 us money to buy chicks, money to buy grain money to live on, you know,
00:10:17 --> 00:10:19 just, we didn't, we didn't have a lot of money in November coming in,
00:10:19 --> 00:10:22 so, or not November and January.
00:10:22 --> 00:10:26 And so getting that influx of cash and we weren't hard line like if.
00:10:27 --> 00:10:29 You know, the people who could pay in January paid and the
00:10:29 --> 00:10:31 people who had to wait until May.
00:10:32 --> 00:10:32 Right.
00:10:32 --> 00:10:33 Waited until May.
00:10:33 --> 00:10:35 And, and, you know, the money would trickle in and we had
00:10:35 --> 00:10:37 some money to, to live on right.
00:10:37 --> 00:10:37 As
00:10:37 --> 00:10:41 we got things going and we, you always made sure we saved enough to
00:10:41 --> 00:10:43 be able to buy the chicks and buy the grain that we needed to buy and Yep.
00:10:45 --> 00:10:48 And then we would often try to buy extra with that money and then know
00:10:48 --> 00:10:50 that that would turn a profit too.
00:10:50 --> 00:10:50 Right.
00:10:50 --> 00:10:54 So we took that as an investment, that early stage money, and we would
00:10:54 --> 00:10:58 invest in if we had an order for, I don't know, 500 chickens, meat
00:10:58 --> 00:11:02 birds, we would try to invest in like 750 or a thousand, whatever we
00:11:02 --> 00:11:03 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:11:03 --> 00:11:04 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: do and pay for.
00:11:04 --> 00:11:09 And then we knew that, like that early bird sale we called, it was like, Hey,
00:11:09 --> 00:11:13 you get a best, you get the best price, you get 10% off or whatever because
00:11:13 --> 00:11:14 you're giving us the money ahead of time.
00:11:15 --> 00:11:15 But the
00:11:15 --> 00:11:18 people who bought afterwards, if they were on the wait list or they.
00:11:18 --> 00:11:19 We needed to wait.
00:11:19 --> 00:11:23 'cause we, we also know in farming, you, you have livestock, you have dead stock.
00:11:23 --> 00:11:25 There could be a predator attack.
00:11:25 --> 00:11:27 We needed to buy more than what we buffer.
00:11:27 --> 00:11:27 Yeah.
00:11:27 --> 00:11:27 We
00:11:27 --> 00:11:29 needed to buy more than what we were running.
00:11:29 --> 00:11:29 Yeah.
00:11:30 --> 00:11:34 So, sometimes we had grow out problems because the grain changed
00:11:34 --> 00:11:35 where they were getting it from.
00:11:35 --> 00:11:38 And it, it was not, it would not describe it as easy.
00:11:38 --> 00:11:42 Like some years the chickens just it, and we, I don't think we ever figured out
00:11:42 --> 00:11:44 why, but the chickens just didn't size up.
00:11:45 --> 00:11:45 Right.
00:11:45 --> 00:11:45 And so we
00:11:45 --> 00:11:46 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:11:46 --> 00:11:49 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: even though, you know, we had
00:11:49 --> 00:11:54 promised only to give a certain amount of chickens, we would just
00:11:54 --> 00:11:57 that because we had told them they'd be a five pound average or whatever,
00:11:57 --> 00:12:01 we would give them extra chickens because they were smaller than than
00:12:01 --> 00:12:02 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah, yeah,
00:12:02 --> 00:12:05 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And people never have really had a problem.
00:12:05 --> 00:12:08 They were always appreciative and they, you know, for the most part, we had a
00:12:08 --> 00:12:10 pretty high customer retention rate.
00:12:11 --> 00:12:14 So we switched that also as we learned more things and we tried to
00:12:14 --> 00:12:18 make the customers happy, like no matter what, it was our goal to feed
00:12:18 --> 00:12:19 nourishing food and do that thing,
00:12:19 --> 00:12:23 but we would go from 10 chickens, so you could, you could sign up
00:12:23 --> 00:12:25 for 10 chickens or 20 chickens if you wanted to fill your freezers.
00:12:26 --> 00:12:28 But then we changed that to poundage, like if it was like 500
00:12:28 --> 00:12:29 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:12:29 --> 00:12:31 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: because then it just made it easier.
00:12:31 --> 00:12:34 Like then we could, right then, then if we had a problem with the growth
00:12:35 --> 00:12:39 grow out on the chickens, we could just be like, okay, you're gonna get a
00:12:39 --> 00:12:44 hundred pounds of chicken, whether it's, you know, 25 pounders or, you know,
00:12:44 --> 00:12:48 whatever, 25 four pounders or whatever.
00:12:48 --> 00:12:48 Right, right.
00:12:49 --> 00:12:49 So,
00:12:50 --> 00:12:54 Yeah, and then we, we switched to, we, well we, we include, we started including
00:12:54 --> 00:12:58 lamb and basically did a similar process.
00:12:58 --> 00:13:04 The first year we sold whole carcass lamb or like the, the customer bought
00:13:04 --> 00:13:07 paid by the pound, by the hanging weight.
00:13:07 --> 00:13:11 And we, you know, I think by the second year we realized that was
00:13:11 --> 00:13:18 too cumbersome for our customers and, and for us to, to think about
00:13:18 --> 00:13:20 and to advertise to market that.
00:13:20 --> 00:13:25 So we switched to lamb boxes with a, with a cut, with a, with a
00:13:25 --> 00:13:29 selection of different cuts and with a little bit of optimization.
00:13:30 --> 00:13:33 But by the end, I think we went towards like.
00:13:33 --> 00:13:35 Minimal optimization.
00:13:35 --> 00:13:37 It was just like you had like two choices.
00:13:37 --> 00:13:37 Yeah.
00:13:37 --> 00:13:38 You could
00:13:38 --> 00:13:42 choose your like roasts and stew box or you could choose your steak box.
00:13:42 --> 00:13:46 Like, and then we would just cut all the lamb into like shoulder steaks and
00:13:46 --> 00:13:51 leg steaks and, and then people would often buy like two roasting boxes and
00:13:51 --> 00:13:55 one steak box and they would be totally content with, they were, and they were
00:13:55 --> 00:14:00 about the, each box was the equivalent of about half of a kain lamb grow.
00:14:00 --> 00:14:00 It
00:14:00 --> 00:14:01 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:14:01 --> 00:14:03 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: 17 and a half pounds is what
00:14:03 --> 00:14:06 we figure a half a kain is.
00:14:06 --> 00:14:13 And we, you know, there was usually if we did a, if it was a good year, the
00:14:13 --> 00:14:15 carcas sizes would be a little extra.
00:14:15 --> 00:14:17 So we'd have like, we could.
00:14:18 --> 00:14:21 The customer would get everything they paid for and we'd be able to
00:14:21 --> 00:14:25 retain a little bit more from each of those carcasses that that kind
00:14:25 --> 00:14:29 of the above and beyond that gave us product to sell, you know, off
00:14:29 --> 00:14:33 the website for retail cuts and, and, whatnot.
00:14:33 --> 00:14:33 Yep.
00:14:35 --> 00:14:37 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Two, two things there that really stand out to me.
00:14:37 --> 00:14:41 I love the, the pre-selling of chickens.
00:14:41 --> 00:14:46 E even as well as lamps, because when you're trying to get started, money
00:14:46 --> 00:14:49 flow or cash flow is always an issue.
00:14:49 --> 00:14:54 So if you can afford to grow some, so you have that proof of concept, or at least
00:14:54 --> 00:14:57 it's the way I categorize it in my mind, and you get some of those chickens out,
00:14:57 --> 00:15:03 then you can sell some, then you get the capital needed to grow that first batch
00:15:03 --> 00:15:05 and, and kind of the same way with lamps.
00:15:06 --> 00:15:10 The second thing I, that really stands out to me is making that process easier
00:15:10 --> 00:15:15 for the end user, for the consumer, because I see so many people selling
00:15:15 --> 00:15:19 beef and if it's working for you, how you're selling them, go for it.
00:15:19 --> 00:15:21 I'm not saying you shouldn't be doing it that way.
00:15:21 --> 00:15:24 But it looks kind of com complicated.
00:15:24 --> 00:15:28 Well, I'm, you're gonna pay X amount per pound of hanging weight.
00:15:29 --> 00:15:30 Then you gotta explain what hanging weight
00:15:30 --> 00:15:31 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Right,
00:15:31 --> 00:15:34 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: or, or you can say, well, it'll be so
00:15:34 --> 00:15:35 and so, price per life weight.
00:15:35 --> 00:15:37 You still gotta explain it.
00:15:37 --> 00:15:40 Instead of you can say, here's our price and here's what
00:15:40 --> 00:15:42 you should get approximately.
00:15:42 --> 00:15:46 You know, this is ag, so the product's going to be variable.
00:15:47 --> 00:15:50 Things do happen, but we'll try and get you in there close.
00:15:50 --> 00:15:54 I just think it makes it so much easier for a consumer that's moved
00:15:54 --> 00:15:56 further and further away from the farm.
00:15:56 --> 00:15:58 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And when you're trying to budget your money
00:15:59 --> 00:16:02 as a consumer, I just recently bought a whole beef and it was
00:16:02 --> 00:16:08 excellent, but it was about $800 more than I had planned for,
00:16:08 --> 00:16:09 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yes.
00:16:09 --> 00:16:12 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: you know, that buffer of like, oh wow,
00:16:12 --> 00:16:16 okay, it's $2 or it's $3, and you're trying to just budget yourself
00:16:16 --> 00:16:20 as you go and you're like, oh wait, that was that at first year doing lamb?
00:16:20 --> 00:16:22 That's what the problem was, right?
00:16:22 --> 00:16:25 Because the lambs turned out huge compared to what we were
00:16:25 --> 00:16:26 telling people they were gonna
00:16:27 --> 00:16:27 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:16:28 --> 00:16:28 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And then they were like,
00:16:29 --> 00:16:32 oh, we still owe you $300.
00:16:33 --> 00:16:33 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Right?
00:16:34 --> 00:16:34 Yeah,
00:16:34 --> 00:16:34 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:16:34 --> 00:16:35 We're
00:16:35 --> 00:16:35 like, yeah,
00:16:35 --> 00:16:36 sorry.
00:16:37 --> 00:16:37 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:16:37 --> 00:16:39 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: decided to turn that problem into a
00:16:39 --> 00:16:43 solution, saying, okay, you, you know what you wanna buy, you buy as many boxes
00:16:43 --> 00:16:45 as you want, we'll sign you up for 'em.
00:16:45 --> 00:16:48 And then if there's any excess, we just turn those into cuts
00:16:48 --> 00:16:50 and we sold them on our website.
00:16:50 --> 00:16:50 Yeah.
00:16:50 --> 00:16:50 Or,
00:16:50 --> 00:16:52 or into more boxes.
00:16:52 --> 00:16:52 Yeah.
00:16:52 --> 00:16:52 Right,
00:16:53 --> 00:16:53 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:16:53 --> 00:16:58 And you, you all bring up an excellent point about your budget and you know,
00:16:58 --> 00:17:02 because we're working from a budget and if it goes too beyond our budget, I have
00:17:02 --> 00:17:03 to reach somewhere else to get that money.
00:17:04 --> 00:17:04 Yeah.
00:17:05 --> 00:17:09 You want them to be able to plan for it and really be successful
00:17:09 --> 00:17:13 with that transaction, as well as providing a quality product.
00:17:14 --> 00:17:14 Yeah.
00:17:15 --> 00:17:22 Now, in Maine, Maine is one of the states that we don't have any guests
00:17:22 --> 00:17:24 from on the Grazing Grass Podcast.
00:17:24 --> 00:17:28 And in fact, I reached out to you because you all were in Maine, and then
00:17:28 --> 00:17:30 come find out, oh, you're in Kansas.
00:17:31 --> 00:17:35 But let's just talk about Maine for just a second, because
00:17:35 --> 00:17:37 that's where you were doing this.
00:17:37 --> 00:17:40 What's the Maine environment like, and how did that work for you?
00:17:40 --> 00:17:43 Because when I think about Maine, I think about trees and
00:17:43 --> 00:17:44 I think about cold weather.
00:17:45 --> 00:17:45 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:17:45 --> 00:17:46 Yes, sir.
00:17:46 --> 00:17:49 Well, you know, historically, like my dad always says there's more
00:17:49 --> 00:17:51 trees in Maine than there ever was.
00:17:51 --> 00:17:52 You know, in
00:17:52 --> 00:17:53 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:17:53 --> 00:17:56 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: his the state was cut off in the,
00:17:56 --> 00:17:59 you know, the 16, 17 hundreds.
00:17:59 --> 00:18:04 It was, it was nearly clear cut like the, the bottom two thirds probably,
00:18:04 --> 00:18:05 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:18:05 --> 00:18:08 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: and, and, and cleared for cattle and
00:18:08 --> 00:18:13 sheep in the 18 hundreds, 1860s, there was a million sheep in the state of Maine.
00:18:13 --> 00:18:14 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:18:14 --> 00:18:17 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And as there were in many places that
00:18:17 --> 00:18:18 Maine is not alone in that way.
00:18:18 --> 00:18:23 But today it's mostly, you know, a lot of those old fields are grown
00:18:23 --> 00:18:29 back up into woods and it's a, it's a high rainfall environment.
00:18:29 --> 00:18:32 You get like 55 inches of rain a
00:18:32 --> 00:18:32 year.
00:18:33 --> 00:18:37 And so it's really, you know, it's the ecosystem there wants to be a forest.
00:18:38 --> 00:18:42 And, and the early colonists you know, cleared the land to so they
00:18:42 --> 00:18:46 could grow crops and, and graze livestock and they had the labor
00:18:46 --> 00:18:48 force or wherever to do that.
00:18:49 --> 00:18:53 But it's, it's like we live in a completely different time now there.
00:18:53 --> 00:18:58 And it's there's, there are still numerous dairy farms, but it seems like every year
00:18:58 --> 00:19:00 I hear about dairy farms closing there.
00:19:00 --> 00:19:01 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:19:01 --> 00:19:03 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: The northern, the very northern
00:19:03 --> 00:19:05 part of the state, Aroostook County.
00:19:06 --> 00:19:09 We actually, I have spent very little time up there, but there's a lot
00:19:09 --> 00:19:12 of agriculture at scale up there.
00:19:13 --> 00:19:13 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Okay.
00:19:13 --> 00:19:15 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Crop, some crop growers and
00:19:15 --> 00:19:17 probably some dairy farms.
00:19:18 --> 00:19:21 It's a little, it's there's still more open up there for whatever reason, whereas
00:19:21 --> 00:19:26 the coastal and central areas have a lot of the farms have closed and, and the
00:19:26 --> 00:19:27 land has been allowed to grow back up.
00:19:28 --> 00:19:29 Yeah, there's a lot.
00:19:29 --> 00:19:34 There's the, the main Organic Farmers Association is very active there.
00:19:35 --> 00:19:38 And so it's one of the places where there's probably one, a very high
00:19:38 --> 00:19:44 percentage of small organic farms and some fairly diversified but they're
00:19:44 --> 00:19:48 on smaller acreages, you know, ranging from vegetable production to small
00:19:48 --> 00:19:50 dairy farms and different things.
00:19:50 --> 00:19:55 And you know, we, we were involved in that scene there in Maine at the
00:19:55 --> 00:19:57 beginning of our, our time there.
00:19:57 --> 00:20:02 And just started really for us.
00:20:02 --> 00:20:07 We were just started thinking more about where, where actually do like
00:20:07 --> 00:20:09 does, does God want our, our help?
00:20:09 --> 00:20:13 Like where do we, where can we be the most useful and does it
00:20:13 --> 00:20:18 actually make sense ecologically to be trying to graze cattle or sheep
00:20:18 --> 00:20:20 in a place that wants to be forced?
00:20:20 --> 00:20:20 And,
00:20:21 --> 00:20:22 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:20:22 --> 00:20:23 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: There's definitely the market there
00:20:23 --> 00:20:26 for, for people who wanna buy product.
00:20:27 --> 00:20:31 But, you know, we were trying to think about how to grow, how to build a business
00:20:31 --> 00:20:36 that was you know, that where we could graze a thousand head of cattle or, or
00:20:36 --> 00:20:41 several thousand head of sheep and have the appropriate size land base to do that.
00:20:41 --> 00:20:45 And, And, that was challenging in Maine, especially with the
00:20:45 --> 00:20:49 rising real estate prices and a lot of people moving after covid.
00:20:49 --> 00:20:53 A lot of people moving outta the city and the, the real estate
00:20:53 --> 00:20:54 just went through the roof there.
00:20:55 --> 00:20:55 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:20:55 --> 00:20:56 Yeah.
00:20:56 --> 00:20:59 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: and, you know, houses in towns, but for
00:20:59 --> 00:21:03 farmhouses, you know, people, people in New York City or Boston wanna just,
00:21:04 --> 00:21:08 they have the money and they just go pay whatever price someone puts on an
00:21:08 --> 00:21:10 old farmhouse with a hundred acres.
00:21:10 --> 00:21:14 Like it just blows your mind like the prices that things are selling for.
00:21:15 --> 00:21:18 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Even for here in Oklahoma, the price
00:21:18 --> 00:21:22 increase we got with COVID and there was a few other factors here.
00:21:22 --> 00:21:29 Marijuana growth be or growing marijuana became legal for you had to have permits
00:21:29 --> 00:21:35 and stuff, but that really, through that period really shot land prices up and
00:21:35 --> 00:21:40 Yeah, and, and you couldn't make, it's really difficult to make livestock pay
00:21:40 --> 00:21:44 for land, but then with the increased prices, it's even more difficult.
00:21:44 --> 00:21:49 So I would imagine it's expon that's more expensive in Maine because you're
00:21:49 --> 00:21:52 dealing, you're fairly close to a.
00:21:53 --> 00:21:56 More populated area for your market, which is great,
00:21:57 --> 00:22:01 but you're also working with your dollars go less or go Not as far.
00:22:01 --> 00:22:02 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:22:02 --> 00:22:02 And it
00:22:02 --> 00:22:06 seemed like the solar industry also took off around the same time and Yeah,
00:22:06 --> 00:22:06 that too.
00:22:06 --> 00:22:10 They were were hay fields quite frequently.
00:22:10 --> 00:22:13 I mean, obviously the landowner had to make the deal and
00:22:13 --> 00:22:14 stuff, but it was.
00:22:14 --> 00:22:17 They made it really appealing for many landowners to say yes, to
00:22:17 --> 00:22:21 turning those hay fields into solar grazing or, or solar fields and then
00:22:22 --> 00:22:25 and then, and and clearing forest to put up solar fields through there.
00:22:25 --> 00:22:25 Right.
00:22:25 --> 00:22:26 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:22:27 --> 00:22:27 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: yeah.
00:22:28 --> 00:22:30 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: And that reminds me, so I mentioned
00:22:30 --> 00:22:31 this on a couple episodes ago.
00:22:31 --> 00:22:36 My dad mentioned the other day, pick on my dad just a little bit when he loosens.
00:22:36 --> 00:22:37 He's gonna be unhappy with me.
00:22:37 --> 00:22:41 But he mentioned, he says, you know, we need to build some structures
00:22:41 --> 00:22:44 out in some of our pastures and put shape cloth on them.
00:22:45 --> 00:22:47 I'm like, or we plant some trees.
00:22:48 --> 00:22:51 It doesn't work tomorrow, but it'll get there.
00:22:51 --> 00:22:51 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Right.
00:22:51 --> 00:22:52 Exactly.
00:22:52 --> 00:22:52 Yeah.
00:22:53 --> 00:22:53 Yeah.
00:22:53 --> 00:22:56 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: I I, I do get, it's not quite one-to-one
00:22:56 --> 00:23:00 with a solar panel versus a tree, but to me that just sounds crazy.
00:23:00 --> 00:23:02 To cut 'em down to put in solar panels.
00:23:02 --> 00:23:03 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: yeah.
00:23:03 --> 00:23:06 And, and in places like Maine, it, it never quite made sense
00:23:06 --> 00:23:09 to us because there's so much there's so many cloudy days, right.
00:23:10 --> 00:23:10 There's,
00:23:10 --> 00:23:10 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:23:11 --> 00:23:12 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: it's, you know, coming out to
00:23:12 --> 00:23:15 Kansas, it's not, it's not quite like, Seattle, but it's a lot more
00:23:15 --> 00:23:17 like Seattle than it is Kansas.
00:23:17 --> 00:23:17 Yeah.
00:23:18 --> 00:23:18 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:23:19 --> 00:23:20 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And I get why solar panels don't
00:23:20 --> 00:23:24 work in Kansas 'cause the amount of like hail and wind and wind.
00:23:24 --> 00:23:26 But I don't know that they make sense in Maine either.
00:23:27 --> 00:23:29 They have less hail, but it's very cloudy for the
00:23:29 --> 00:23:30 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:23:30 --> 00:23:32 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: If, if we had wanted to, we
00:23:32 --> 00:23:35 probably could have built a business in Maine on solar grazing.
00:23:35 --> 00:23:35 But,
00:23:36 --> 00:23:36 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:23:37 --> 00:23:38 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: We're a little concerned about
00:23:38 --> 00:23:43 unintended consequences that things just outside of our knowledge base around
00:23:43 --> 00:23:47 the solar panels and grazing animals under them, you know, to those who
00:23:47 --> 00:23:49 are doing it like more power to 'em.
00:23:50 --> 00:23:51 But it's not our.
00:23:51 --> 00:23:55 It's not our, this, this, when we think about how we want life to be,
00:23:55 --> 00:23:59 either, you know, today or in the future, like being around a bunch
00:23:59 --> 00:24:01 of solar panels is not how we want
00:24:01 --> 00:24:02 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:24:02 --> 00:24:04 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: So I, I'd like to have a house with solar
00:24:04 --> 00:24:07 panels on the roof possibly, or, you know,
00:24:07 --> 00:24:07 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Right.
00:24:08 --> 00:24:10 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: feel a field full of solar panels.
00:24:10 --> 00:24:12 Just seems like a, yeah, not a, not, or
00:24:13 --> 00:24:16 fill a parking lot, fill a solar panel so the cars can have some shade
00:24:16 --> 00:24:17 or something that's already Yeah.
00:24:17 --> 00:24:18 Put them
00:24:18 --> 00:24:21 on the big box stores and over all the parked cars, like Right.
00:24:21 --> 00:24:24 There's so many other places to put 'em than where we produce our food.
00:24:24 --> 00:24:24 Right.
00:24:25 --> 00:24:26 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: I, I agree.
00:24:26 --> 00:24:28 I, I have to, I see some of these places.
00:24:28 --> 00:24:31 They put solar panels and I'm like, why?
00:24:32 --> 00:24:35 If you'd raise them a little bit higher, put 'em over some cars,
00:24:35 --> 00:24:40 provide a little shelter there, or how many houses and barns are out there
00:24:40 --> 00:24:42 that we could put solar panels on?
00:24:42 --> 00:24:46 I know that creates a more fragmented system and it's not as
00:24:46 --> 00:24:48 efficient and stuff, but, but wow.
00:24:48 --> 00:24:50 I just think there's so many opportunities out there.
00:24:50 --> 00:24:52 I'm like, why'd you put it there?
00:24:52 --> 00:24:56 And now we have that fenced off, and then some, sometimes they put 'em solo
00:24:56 --> 00:24:58 to the ground and put gravel under 'em.
00:24:58 --> 00:24:59 I'm like, why?
00:24:59 --> 00:25:00 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:25:00 --> 00:25:00 Yeah.
00:25:01 --> 00:25:05 And, and with things like the PFAS thing that happened, I don't know, two or three
00:25:05 --> 00:25:08 years ago that came out in Maine and it was just like the whole state of Maine,
00:25:08 --> 00:25:13 like for the most part, people who were told in the seventies or the eighties
00:25:13 --> 00:25:17 when the Clean Water Act came like, here, dump this refuge on your farms.
00:25:17 --> 00:25:17 We'll get
00:25:17 --> 00:25:19 rid of it that way instead of dumping it in the water.
00:25:19 --> 00:25:22 And and then there's all the unintended consequences that
00:25:22 --> 00:25:23 come out 20 to 30 years later.
00:25:23 --> 00:25:23 Yeah.
00:25:23 --> 00:25:23 I dunno if
00:25:23 --> 00:25:24 you heard that.
00:25:24 --> 00:25:27 That's the kind of the most recent thing in Maine was they've actually had to close
00:25:27 --> 00:25:30 farms down because of too high of PFAS
00:25:30 --> 00:25:31 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: oh, no.
00:25:31 --> 00:25:32 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: in the soil and in the water
00:25:32 --> 00:25:33 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah,
00:25:34 --> 00:25:35 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Quite a few farms are, have been
00:25:36 --> 00:25:37 just shut down.
00:25:38 --> 00:25:42 And so that, you know, that was a, that was all part of the concern too.
00:25:42 --> 00:25:46 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: And, and you know, as we kinda dumped the main,
00:25:46 --> 00:25:49 just a little bit there and didn't actually mean to dump 'em too bad.
00:25:49 --> 00:25:53 I still plan on getting someone on the podcast from Maine, but Everywhere's
00:25:53 --> 00:25:55 got their own issues and stuff.
00:25:55 --> 00:25:56 But as you.
00:25:57 --> 00:26:02 A, as you all thought about you all's future and thought we need to move
00:26:02 --> 00:26:07 somewhere else, talk a little bit about that decision and then your process
00:26:07 --> 00:26:12 to start looking elsewhere because, well, I talked to someone the other day
00:26:12 --> 00:26:14 and they were in downtown of a city.
00:26:14 --> 00:26:18 Obviously they're gonna have to move somewhere, but that's a big
00:26:18 --> 00:26:24 decision to take your family and uproot 'em and go across the country.
00:26:24 --> 00:26:28 So talk a little bit about that decision because there, there may be others
00:26:28 --> 00:26:32 facing that decision and what are some things they need to think about.
00:26:32 --> 00:26:35 And I just asked you a hundred questions.
00:26:35 --> 00:26:36 I apologize for that.
00:26:37 --> 00:26:37 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: no worries.
00:26:37 --> 00:26:38 It's okay.
00:26:38 --> 00:26:40 No, it's a, it was a humbling experience.
00:26:40 --> 00:26:40 Yeah.
00:26:40 --> 00:26:42 I basically, I grew up in Maine.
00:26:42 --> 00:26:45 My, my parents have always lived in Maine, you know.
00:26:46 --> 00:26:49 It's it was like a, it was part of my identity, you know,
00:26:49 --> 00:26:52 I'm this is where I'm from and I'm always gonna live here, kind
00:26:52 --> 00:26:54 of attitude is what I always had.
00:26:54 --> 00:26:58 I did have a short stint in Vermont, and that's where I met Sarah,
00:26:58 --> 00:27:01 but shortly after we got married, it was like, okay, it's time to
00:27:02 --> 00:27:03 move back, move back to Maine.
00:27:03 --> 00:27:08 And and so the, I, when we made that choice to move back to Maine, I never
00:27:08 --> 00:27:11 thought we would move from Maine.
00:27:11 --> 00:27:15 The intent was to go back to my parents', small, rough acreage and try
00:27:15 --> 00:27:20 to build a farm that we, a profitable farm business on, whatever, like
00:27:20 --> 00:27:24 10 acres, you know, like whatever the 10 acres of usable land there.
00:27:24 --> 00:27:29 And and so when we started, you know, there was, it was multi,
00:27:29 --> 00:27:31 there was multiple reasons.
00:27:31 --> 00:27:35 We had an insecure land situation that we were using.
00:27:35 --> 00:27:37 And so that was a big part of it.
00:27:37 --> 00:27:39 That was really kind of the catalyst.
00:27:39 --> 00:27:43 But there was also this desire to ha be part of a big, the bigger
00:27:43 --> 00:27:48 regenerative movement and be doing the work where it actually meant something.
00:27:49 --> 00:27:52 'cause if we, like, the way I viewed it, where the land that we were working
00:27:52 --> 00:27:58 in Maine if we just stopped what we were doing and nobody did like grazed
00:27:58 --> 00:28:03 another animal there, it would've just grown back up into forest.
00:28:03 --> 00:28:04 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:28:04 --> 00:28:07 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: the land wouldn't have complained one bit,
00:28:07 --> 00:28:11 like the, the trees and the, and all the wild animals would've just moved right in
00:28:12 --> 00:28:15 and it wouldn't have been become a desert.
00:28:15 --> 00:28:15 Right.
00:28:16 --> 00:28:23 And so, so there was a big part of it for me that really wanted to move to, you
00:28:23 --> 00:28:27 know, move to a place where the work we were doing actually meant something for
00:28:27 --> 00:28:29 the long term that we were helping to.
00:28:30 --> 00:28:34 You know, be part of a movement that's reversing diver desertification and
00:28:34 --> 00:28:39 increasing life in a place where, you know, where it's got ra low rainfall
00:28:39 --> 00:28:40 and needs that herbivore impact.
00:28:41 --> 00:28:46 There was also, you know, the financial piece where it was though our business
00:28:46 --> 00:28:51 was growing each year organically, it was, we were doing better each year.
00:28:51 --> 00:28:54 It was still very challenging financially to make it all work.
00:28:54 --> 00:28:55 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:28:55 --> 00:28:56 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: we, yeah.
00:28:56 --> 00:29:00 But I think going back to the land agreement we had, it was mostly that,
00:29:00 --> 00:29:03 because again, we were like, things were really, it was the best year
00:29:03 --> 00:29:05 yet when we were on our last year.
00:29:05 --> 00:29:05 Yeah.
00:29:05 --> 00:29:06 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:29:06 --> 00:29:08 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: with cost of things going up too
00:29:09 --> 00:29:13 in the current economy, it's hard to predict if it would've stayed.
00:29:13 --> 00:29:14 Well, good.
00:29:14 --> 00:29:14 Yeah.
00:29:14 --> 00:29:15 You know,
00:29:15 --> 00:29:18 well, like, you know, if things went, it's like if things went, went really
00:29:18 --> 00:29:22 bad and people didn't have money to buy expensive lamb, will, will
00:29:22 --> 00:29:23 we still be able to be in business?
00:29:23 --> 00:29:27 Or will I, will I have to go back to the, you know, I was a carpenter before
00:29:27 --> 00:29:35 when I always was trying to farm, but I, my main occupation was building houses.
00:29:35 --> 00:29:41 We did that for on the side for years while farming up until probably 2018,
00:29:41 --> 00:29:45 I was working as a carpenter and, and, you know, do farming early in the morning
00:29:45 --> 00:29:47 and into the night with a headlamp.
00:29:48 --> 00:29:52 And, and so it was like, how can we actually make a living.
00:29:53 --> 00:29:57 How, you know, how can we make enough money and be doing this in
00:29:57 --> 00:30:02 a place that makes sense, you know, ecologically and, and then also
00:30:02 --> 00:30:04 wanting to be part of a community.
00:30:04 --> 00:30:07 You know, like Sarah said, the people in Maine are amazing, but we found very
00:30:07 --> 00:30:13 little comradery in people who are seeking to understand how to graze animals.
00:30:13 --> 00:30:14 Regeneratively.
00:30:14 --> 00:30:15 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:30:16 --> 00:30:17 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: There were, there were pe
00:30:17 --> 00:30:18 There are people there.
00:30:18 --> 00:30:18 Yeah.
00:30:18 --> 00:30:21 It's not, there's none, but there you know, we couldn't just go to like
00:30:21 --> 00:30:23 a a conference on regenerative ag.
00:30:24 --> 00:30:27 A lot of the conferences we did go to the solutions.
00:30:27 --> 00:30:29 Were always very technological based.
00:30:29 --> 00:30:33 Like, you know, you know, you need to, you know, in, you know, for market
00:30:33 --> 00:30:36 gardeners, it's like you need to put up more greenhouses or, you know.
00:30:36 --> 00:30:37 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:30:37 --> 00:30:39 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: You need, you know, for, to combat
00:30:39 --> 00:30:43 climate change, you, you know, you need to, you need to put in more irrigation
00:30:43 --> 00:30:45 and, you know, do different things.
00:30:45 --> 00:30:50 And we were like, nah, you just need more livestock and like, you need to, you know,
00:30:50 --> 00:30:52 include livestock in your operations.
00:30:52 --> 00:30:56 And and so we were sort of, black sheep in a way, in that way.
00:30:56 --> 00:31:01 Like I, I personally could never quite a hundred percent agree with a lot of
00:31:01 --> 00:31:03 the other folks in the community there.
00:31:03 --> 00:31:03 'cause I was
00:31:03 --> 00:31:04 like, just so adamant.
00:31:04 --> 00:31:07 We need, you need more livestock on your operations.
00:31:07 --> 00:31:11 Even if you had an orchard or a, or a.
00:31:12 --> 00:31:15 Grain farm or a vegetable garden.
00:31:15 --> 00:31:18 How could you in, in include li more livestock?
00:31:19 --> 00:31:22 And that was just wasn't really talked, you know, I mean, to, it
00:31:22 --> 00:31:25 is to some degree talked about, but not as much as I wanted to be.
00:31:25 --> 00:31:30 And the mo so, so it was just, you know, there was so many d different
00:31:30 --> 00:31:34 facets and we really just started kind of preying on it and looking at you
00:31:34 --> 00:31:38 know, kind of job opportunities that were, you know, listed in different,
00:31:38 --> 00:31:40 you know, job boards or whatever.
00:31:41 --> 00:31:46 And I remember we, you know, we, we homeschool, so we were looking
00:31:46 --> 00:31:50 at like, which states have the best laws for homeschooling.
00:31:50 --> 00:31:51 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:31:51 --> 00:31:53 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: We, we didn't wanna be like really far,
00:31:53 --> 00:31:56 like in a place that was like, like.
00:31:58 --> 00:32:00 We didn't wanna go right from Maine to like South Texas.
00:32:00 --> 00:32:04 That was a place we, we were considering a, a job opportunity
00:32:04 --> 00:32:08 in South Texas and seemed like a little bit too big of a jump.
00:32:09 --> 00:32:09 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:32:09 --> 00:32:10 Yeah.
00:32:10 --> 00:32:17 So, so what I'm hearing there, first off, that identity issue, I hate
00:32:17 --> 00:32:20 to say it issue, but your identity is tied to where you grow up.
00:32:20 --> 00:32:26 I know for me, I am, I'm in northeast Oklahoma and I go over into Missouri and
00:32:26 --> 00:32:31 Arkansas, even eastern Texas, and I'm like, these areas are nice, Louisiana.
00:32:32 --> 00:32:36 They would be nice to live here, but I'm a Okie.
00:32:37 --> 00:32:40 So, so, and, and then the other thing, you talked about some,
00:32:40 --> 00:32:43 some other things in there for me.
00:32:44 --> 00:32:48 My family lives here close and I don't wanna move further away than I am.
00:32:48 --> 00:32:51 So that really constrains me to that area.
00:32:51 --> 00:32:52 But we all have that criteria.
00:32:52 --> 00:32:56 Like you mentioned, going to South Texas would be a huge change.
00:32:56 --> 00:33:00 So as you looked at, you're like, what fits into what I'm comfortable with?
00:33:01 --> 00:33:02 so that worked out.
00:33:02 --> 00:33:05 So as you looked at homeschooling and stuff, you said you ended up
00:33:05 --> 00:33:07 in Kansas, so obviously that works.
00:33:07 --> 00:33:10 What were some other states you were looking at?
00:33:10 --> 00:33:12 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Well, real fast, I do wanna just speak
00:33:12 --> 00:33:14 to, you mentioned the family aspect.
00:33:14 --> 00:33:17 It was, that was probably the single hardest factor
00:33:17 --> 00:33:17 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, I
00:33:18 --> 00:33:20 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: moving, you know, my parents and my,
00:33:20 --> 00:33:22 my siblings and family are in Maine.
00:33:23 --> 00:33:26 Sarah's parents are in, in the Boston area.
00:33:26 --> 00:33:27 They're a drive.
00:33:27 --> 00:33:29 They were a drive away if we
00:33:29 --> 00:33:29 wanted to go visit.
00:33:30 --> 00:33:33 And it was, that was the single, that was probably the biggest factor
00:33:33 --> 00:33:37 of, of thinking about, okay, we're taking the kids away from the family,
00:33:37 --> 00:33:39 you know, how's that gonna be?
00:33:39 --> 00:33:43 And we had really had to weigh out that kinda like, well, is the quality of
00:33:43 --> 00:33:48 life we're giving them here in Maine with access to see family occasionally
00:33:50 --> 00:33:54 better than if we, you are in a more secure situation doing the important
00:33:54 --> 00:33:58 work that we see important, you know, that we hold so valuable to be doing.
00:33:59 --> 00:34:01 And so, you know, we kind just kind of kept preying
00:34:01 --> 00:34:05 on it, but I, you know, I've transitioned myself from
00:34:05 --> 00:34:07 thinking of myself as a maner to.
00:34:08 --> 00:34:08 to.
00:34:08 --> 00:34:10 you know, a human from earth.
00:34:10 --> 00:34:11 You know, like I feel
00:34:11 --> 00:34:13 like now I, I feel so free.
00:34:13 --> 00:34:15 Like, I feel like I could live anywhere and,
00:34:16 --> 00:34:16 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yeah.
00:34:17 --> 00:34:18 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: like if, if for whatever reason it
00:34:18 --> 00:34:23 doesn't work out here, here in Kansas, like, you know, we could, we could go
00:34:23 --> 00:34:28 anywhere and, and do this work and, and and feel just like liberated in that way.
00:34:28 --> 00:34:29 It's amazing.
00:34:29 --> 00:34:35 And I'm very sensitive too to the people who grew up here and, and you know, I, you
00:34:35 --> 00:34:41 know, coming from a perspective, always being from a place like I don't really
00:34:41 --> 00:34:46 wanna like negatively impact the quality of life here for the people who have
00:34:46 --> 00:34:46 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:34:47 --> 00:34:51 Speaker 2: At Redmond, we know that you thrive when your animals do.
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00:34:55 --> 00:34:57 with the minerals that they need.
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00:35:03 --> 00:35:08 catalyst in optimizing the nutrients your animals get from their forage.
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00:35:13 --> 00:35:16 to help that your animals prefer.
00:35:16 --> 00:35:20 This gives your herd the ability to naturally regulate their
00:35:20 --> 00:35:23 mineral consumption as they graze.
00:35:24 --> 00:35:27 Our minerals won't just help you improve the health of your animals,
00:35:28 --> 00:35:33 but will also help you naturally build soil fertility so you can grow more
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00:35:41 --> 00:35:42 Learn more at redmondagriculture.
00:35:44 --> 00:35:44 com
00:35:44 --> 00:35:47 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Mike, I, I wanna jump back into that family
00:35:47 --> 00:35:50 discussion just a little bit more.
00:35:50 --> 00:35:56 Were your family supportive of this, and then do you feel like moving
00:35:56 --> 00:36:01 there, you were closer to 'em in Maine, but just because you're close
00:36:01 --> 00:36:05 does not mean you, you see 'em and communicate as much as you would like?
00:36:05 --> 00:36:08 Is that going to change much with you in Kansas,
00:36:09 --> 00:36:09 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: right.
00:36:09 --> 00:36:10 That was sort of, we started,
00:36:11 --> 00:36:14 you know, kind of looking at, like, we would go to see my
00:36:14 --> 00:36:15 parents like once a month.
00:36:15 --> 00:36:18 They would come up and see us maybe once a month or every other month.
00:36:18 --> 00:36:21 We were an hour and a half from my folks.
00:36:22 --> 00:36:24 And and they were pretty much the only family members that
00:36:24 --> 00:36:25 would come up and visit us.
00:36:26 --> 00:36:30 Because we, we, we started out on their property, but we in eventually got a
00:36:30 --> 00:36:35 opportunity to work to manage some land and live in a house in central Maine.
00:36:36 --> 00:36:39 And so that was, you know, like I said, an hour and a half away.
00:36:40 --> 00:36:41 So we were pretty much.
00:36:42 --> 00:36:47 We didn't get very few visitors and we, we, I, I was going back to my hometown
00:36:47 --> 00:36:49 to deliver product on a weekly basis.
00:36:49 --> 00:36:54 So I would stop in and see my parents for the first few years, like every week.
00:36:54 --> 00:36:59 And sometimes the kids or Sarah were with me and sometimes they, it was just me.
00:36:59 --> 00:37:00 Probably most of the time it was just me.
00:37:00 --> 00:37:05 But then a month they would come down and they would come up and
00:37:05 --> 00:37:08 visit us, or we'd, we'd all make the trek down for family gatherings.
00:37:08 --> 00:37:12 But it was like, if we added up, it was like, we were always in a rush.
00:37:12 --> 00:37:13 We'd be like, we'd be
00:37:14 --> 00:37:15 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: That is so true.
00:37:15 --> 00:37:17 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: two and we were usually come,
00:37:17 --> 00:37:20 we were combining it with like a delivery or something.
00:37:20 --> 00:37:25 So we, so we, we could only visit for an hour or so, and then we'd
00:37:25 --> 00:37:27 have to make the long drive back at late, you know, late at night and
00:37:27 --> 00:37:29 get home late and have chores to do.
00:37:29 --> 00:37:33 And the visits were always just felt a little rushed.
00:37:33 --> 00:37:35 We started saying, well, you know, with a.
00:37:36 --> 00:37:41 If we take a job opportunity that has some time off included, and we can just come
00:37:41 --> 00:37:45 back to Maine, if that's what we wanna do, then we could actually spend like
00:37:45 --> 00:37:47 a week with Grammy and Grandpa and, and
00:37:47 --> 00:37:48 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:37:48 --> 00:37:49 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: not feel like we're gonna
00:37:49 --> 00:37:50 rush off quality time.
00:37:50 --> 00:37:50 Yeah.
00:37:50 --> 00:37:51 And have
00:37:51 --> 00:37:51 quality time.
00:37:52 --> 00:37:52 Yep.
00:37:52 --> 00:37:53 You know?
00:37:53 --> 00:37:58 And, and with the balance of it all, like Nick was working and I was working,
00:37:58 --> 00:38:04 I was like mostly in charge of the website like the YouTube channel, the,
00:38:04 --> 00:38:09 the Facebook page, the all those things, but also accounting and egg packing.
00:38:10 --> 00:38:13 And we, you know, at one point we had 800 chickens, so we had something around
00:38:13 --> 00:38:14 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh,
00:38:14 --> 00:38:16 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: light, 400 eggs a day.
00:38:16 --> 00:38:22 So between the two of us, practically working more than full-time our kids
00:38:22 --> 00:38:24 were falling through the cracks.
00:38:24 --> 00:38:25 And so.
00:38:25 --> 00:38:29 And, and, and our, my family were, are great, but they didn't
00:38:29 --> 00:38:32 really, they, and what we were doing was not important to them.
00:38:32 --> 00:38:33 And they
00:38:33 --> 00:38:33 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:38:34 --> 00:38:35 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: they, we had no support.
00:38:35 --> 00:38:39 So it was just us doing, we, we value family time.
00:38:39 --> 00:38:41 We value three meals a day.
00:38:41 --> 00:38:43 We value sitting down at the table together.
00:38:43 --> 00:38:44 And we value reading at night.
00:38:44 --> 00:38:47 We don't, we don't do screens and we don't do technology a lot.
00:38:47 --> 00:38:51 We just do, you know, kind of just life and kids learning,
00:38:51 --> 00:38:52 but they would be with us.
00:38:52 --> 00:38:54 And those times were amazing.
00:38:54 --> 00:38:57 But the times that would fall through the cracks was like, as we were
00:38:57 --> 00:39:00 getting, as my kids were getting older and they were homeschooling
00:39:00 --> 00:39:01 we couldn't afford curriculum.
00:39:01 --> 00:39:04 We couldn't, I mean, and there's a lot of free resources out there and I was
00:39:04 --> 00:39:06 like the best at finding them for the
00:39:06 --> 00:39:07 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah, but
00:39:07 --> 00:39:07 that takes time.
00:39:08 --> 00:39:09 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: it takes time.
00:39:09 --> 00:39:09 Right.
00:39:09 --> 00:39:12 And then just like sitting down with them for a few minutes, like they're
00:39:12 --> 00:39:17 super smart and you know, they can do a lot of like fencing skills and
00:39:17 --> 00:39:18 electrical work and plumbing work.
00:39:18 --> 00:39:19 Yeah.
00:39:19 --> 00:39:21 But you know, like farm, farm electrical,
00:39:21 --> 00:39:21 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yes.
00:39:22 --> 00:39:23 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Fencing and, and running
00:39:23 --> 00:39:24 water lines for animals.
00:39:24 --> 00:39:25 Right.
00:39:25 --> 00:39:26 But the, like, sitting down to do
00:39:26 --> 00:39:29 like the worksheets or whatever, I, I don't value that as much,
00:39:29 --> 00:39:32 but I think there's a time and a place for a little bit of that.
00:39:32 --> 00:39:36 And to read and learning to write, it takes time and you have to sit down
00:39:36 --> 00:39:39 and you have to take time with your kids to sit down with, read with them.
00:39:39 --> 00:39:45 And so now he is mostly got the job and we help out when we want to and when we can,
00:39:45 --> 00:39:45 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:39:45 --> 00:39:47 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: it's, it's shifted the dynamic a
00:39:47 --> 00:39:51 little bit more where I can support the house a lot more and he can
00:39:51 --> 00:39:53 support the family financially.
00:39:53 --> 00:39:58 And and, and Sarah also, because she has all the the spreadsheet knowledge
00:39:58 --> 00:40:02 and stuff, she is actually very helpful to the business, even as,
00:40:02 --> 00:40:04 you know, just as an auxiliary to me.
00:40:05 --> 00:40:05 And
00:40:06 --> 00:40:07 she kind of helps, helps.
00:40:08 --> 00:40:11 She's not a paid employee, but she helps me a lot with,
00:40:11 --> 00:40:12 with the work that I'm doing.
00:40:13 --> 00:40:13 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:40:14 --> 00:40:19 Well, and you know, as, as I think about it, and for some people,
00:40:19 --> 00:40:22 depending on how often you see.
00:40:23 --> 00:40:28 Your family moving further away does may not adversely affect that.
00:40:29 --> 00:40:33 And for, like you, you mentioned before, you'd see a, well, you're busy,
00:40:33 --> 00:40:37 so it's a quick drop in, hello, talk for a minute, and then you're gone.
00:40:38 --> 00:40:43 Whereas now you have the ability to go back and visit for a longer period
00:40:43 --> 00:40:48 of time without those demands that the quality of, of the visits much greater.
00:40:48 --> 00:40:51 So I, I think that's an important consideration.
00:40:51 --> 00:40:52 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: I think so.
00:40:53 --> 00:40:53 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:40:54 --> 00:40:55 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:40:55 --> 00:40:55 Yeah.
00:40:55 --> 00:41:00 And and that's, you know, and we, we, we, we do, video chats with my, my
00:41:00 --> 00:41:03 folks and other, other family members like frequently.
00:41:03 --> 00:41:06 And you know, that technology is definitely, like, if it was a hundred
00:41:06 --> 00:41:07 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Definitely helps.
00:41:07 --> 00:41:07 Yeah.
00:41:07 --> 00:41:09 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: It, we would, you know, be writing
00:41:09 --> 00:41:12 letters back and forth and the kids actually do write a fair amount of
00:41:12 --> 00:41:14 letters to like their friends and some of their cousins in Maine.
00:41:15 --> 00:41:18 So, so that's, they get to practice their writing and stay in touch with
00:41:18 --> 00:41:23 people through, through just old school, you know, paper and pen.
00:41:24 --> 00:41:24 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:41:25 --> 00:41:26 Which I think is a great practice.
00:41:26 --> 00:41:33 I, I wish, and I say this and I'm gonna say this, and I don't do it now, nor
00:41:33 --> 00:41:37 am I going to practice and get to the point that I do it any time in my life.
00:41:37 --> 00:41:43 But I wish I was, you know, had that habit of letter writing
00:41:43 --> 00:41:43 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: me too.
00:41:44 --> 00:41:46 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: as a younger person to do it now.
00:41:46 --> 00:41:50 And, and I'm not saying it with any illusions, that's tomorrow I'm gonna
00:41:50 --> 00:41:53 start learning how, because I'm, I'm not going to, I'm not gonna put the
00:41:53 --> 00:41:55 time towards it, but I wish I had that.
00:41:55 --> 00:41:55 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Right.
00:41:55 --> 00:41:56 Same.
00:41:56 --> 00:41:56 Same.
00:41:57 --> 00:41:57 Yeah.
00:41:58 --> 00:41:58 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:41:58 --> 00:42:03 So in getting ready for the move across country and then moving across
00:42:03 --> 00:42:07 country, was there anything now that you are there, you wish you'd known
00:42:07 --> 00:42:09 before you started the process?
00:42:09 --> 00:42:09 I.
00:42:10 --> 00:42:11 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: I don't know.
00:42:11 --> 00:42:13 My quick answer is no.
00:42:13 --> 00:42:13 Yeah.
00:42:13 --> 00:42:14 It felt
00:42:14 --> 00:42:14 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: good.
00:42:14 --> 00:42:17 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: it felt like a, we made the decision
00:42:17 --> 00:42:21 and everything just fell into place, and whether that was the hand of
00:42:21 --> 00:42:23 God just helping us get there.
00:42:23 --> 00:42:27 But we decided to stay at a few Airbnbs along the way because
00:42:27 --> 00:42:30 we had livestock guardian dogs that we were bringing with us.
00:42:30 --> 00:42:30 And
00:42:30 --> 00:42:30 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: yes.
00:42:31 --> 00:42:32 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: so we just was like, oh.
00:42:32 --> 00:42:34 And then we decided to stop at Greg Judy's place.
00:42:34 --> 00:42:36 We were like, he's in Missouri.
00:42:36 --> 00:42:37 It's on the way to Kansas.
00:42:37 --> 00:42:39 So, and they, they've got an Airbnb.
00:42:39 --> 00:42:40 Yeah,
00:42:40 --> 00:42:41 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yes they do.
00:42:41 --> 00:42:41 Yeah,
00:42:41 --> 00:42:43 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: So we stayed at his place.
00:42:43 --> 00:42:46 And, and pestered I can't remember his wife's name.
00:42:46 --> 00:42:48 Kind of pestered her to Jan.
00:42:48 --> 00:42:52 Yeah, Jan, we, we, we were like, is there any way we can see Greg?
00:42:52 --> 00:42:55 Because the Airbnb is like, they don't necessarily interact
00:42:55 --> 00:42:57 with the Airbnb people,
00:42:57 --> 00:43:00 so if you, you might see them, you might not.
00:43:00 --> 00:43:02 And so we're like, is there any way we can see Greg?
00:43:02 --> 00:43:06 And so he, she's like, oh, he, well, he is gotta go move the bulls.
00:43:06 --> 00:43:07 You could help him with that.
00:43:07 --> 00:43:11 So we, we went and helped, helped him move the bulls for
00:43:12 --> 00:43:12 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, nice.
00:43:13 --> 00:43:15 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And he gave us a de, you know, demonstration
00:43:15 --> 00:43:20 of how the bale and roller works, and they gave the kids a ride on his four wheeler.
00:43:20 --> 00:43:20 And
00:43:21 --> 00:43:21 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:43:22 --> 00:43:22 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: fun.
00:43:22 --> 00:43:24 The kids started making like little, oh yeah.
00:43:24 --> 00:43:26 Trinkets with the grass that he hates or something.
00:43:26 --> 00:43:27 What was the broom?
00:43:27 --> 00:43:28 Grass?
00:43:28 --> 00:43:30 It was not, not broom grass.
00:43:30 --> 00:43:31 The broom.
00:43:31 --> 00:43:31 The broomed
00:43:32 --> 00:43:33 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, oh, yes.
00:43:33 --> 00:43:33 Yeah.
00:43:33 --> 00:43:33 Broom.
00:43:33 --> 00:43:35 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: making, like we, we were talking
00:43:35 --> 00:43:36 and they were just bored.
00:43:36 --> 00:43:39 So they started sitting on the ground weaving broomed and he's like, I've
00:43:39 --> 00:43:41 never seen kids do this before.
00:43:42 --> 00:43:42 This is amazing.
00:43:44 --> 00:43:44 So,
00:43:44 --> 00:43:45 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: And that's the best use for Broom
00:43:45 --> 00:43:47 said I've ever heard of.
00:43:49 --> 00:43:49 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: yep.
00:43:50 --> 00:43:51 So it's a good time.
00:43:51 --> 00:43:53 So we just, we just said, Hey, we're going across the country.
00:43:53 --> 00:43:54 Where can we stop?
00:43:54 --> 00:43:55 Who do we wanna see?
00:43:55 --> 00:43:55 Yeah.
00:43:55 --> 00:43:57 And what's the best way to get there?
00:43:57 --> 00:43:58 And just to back up a little bit, we.
00:43:59 --> 00:44:03 So I agreed to take the job and then we just listed everything.
00:44:03 --> 00:44:09 We had a bunch of sheep and some, a few had a cattle that and some
00:44:09 --> 00:44:11 other like equipment stuff that needed, all needed to be sold.
00:44:11 --> 00:44:13 'cause we knew we couldn't bring it with us.
00:44:14 --> 00:44:19 And within like two weeks of it being listed on Facebook, between other
00:44:19 --> 00:44:24 people sharing it and just people who wanna support us, they people bought
00:44:24 --> 00:44:26 everything we had to, to sell basically.
00:44:26 --> 00:44:27 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, nice.
00:44:27 --> 00:44:27 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:44:28 --> 00:44:31 You know, I think we, we have, there's been times being here that we wish we'd
00:44:31 --> 00:44:32 figured out how to bring our milk cow.
00:44:33 --> 00:44:34 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:44:34 --> 00:44:37 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: 'cause we realized out here that milk
00:44:37 --> 00:44:40 cows are sort of rare and more expensive.
00:44:41 --> 00:44:43 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, they're, they're pretty pricey right now to
00:44:43 --> 00:44:45 get a nice milk cow for the farm.
00:44:45 --> 00:44:47 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And it seems like the cattle market out
00:44:47 --> 00:44:52 here, we were there's a probably, there's an interesting thing being in Maine.
00:44:53 --> 00:44:53 I don't know.
00:44:53 --> 00:44:55 The cattle prices are very different.
00:44:55 --> 00:45:00 They like, are maybe slower to like cows in, in general or steers might be
00:45:00 --> 00:45:05 cheaper there than they are here, whereas the, the prices just kept going up and
00:45:05 --> 00:45:07 more affected on the, on the daily, on the, yeah.
00:45:07 --> 00:45:08 Weekly
00:45:08 --> 00:45:09 cow prices.
00:45:09 --> 00:45:09 yeah.
00:45:10 --> 00:45:14 So a 1500 milk cow, there is like a 4 milk cow here.
00:45:14 --> 00:45:14 It's
00:45:14 --> 00:45:15 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yes.
00:45:16 --> 00:45:16 Yeah,
00:45:17 --> 00:45:17 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:45:17 --> 00:45:18 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: yeah.
00:45:18 --> 00:45:20 My, my daughter's looking for a milk cow.
00:45:20 --> 00:45:25 And the prices we see, I saw one for 3 the other day.
00:45:25 --> 00:45:27 But yeah, that's the floor.
00:45:27 --> 00:45:30 It just seems like they're, they're much higher than that.
00:45:30 --> 00:45:32 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: it's almost like looking for a horse, you know,
00:45:33 --> 00:45:33 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yeah.
00:45:34 --> 00:45:34 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: it's, or a vehicle.
00:45:35 --> 00:45:35 Or a vehicle.
00:45:37 --> 00:45:37 Right.
00:45:37 --> 00:45:41 And to go back to like our, our quality of life in Maine when we,
00:45:41 --> 00:45:46 we, we like holistic, like a holistic mindset, like an Alan Savory,
00:45:46 --> 00:45:47 like how do you want life to be?
00:45:47 --> 00:45:49 We really liked that model.
00:45:49 --> 00:45:53 And there were many times where we couldn't afford to run a
00:45:53 --> 00:45:54 truck because our truck broke.
00:45:55 --> 00:45:59 And it was like we had, we had one vehicle for most of the time that we were, you
00:45:59 --> 00:46:02 know, operating a, a, a business in Maine.
00:46:02 --> 00:46:05 And it was our family vehicle and our farm vehicle.
00:46:05 --> 00:46:06 We, you know, it was a,
00:46:07 --> 00:46:07 a, a,
00:46:08 --> 00:46:11 Toyota Tacoma with, you're not Tacoma, a tundra with a backseat.
00:46:11 --> 00:46:14 And the kids, just three kids squished in that backseat.
00:46:14 --> 00:46:17 And we, we went everywhere in that.
00:46:17 --> 00:46:17 Yeah.
00:46:18 --> 00:46:23 And so it would break down and then again, the price increases
00:46:23 --> 00:46:24 over the last four or five years.
00:46:24 --> 00:46:28 It just I had a good mechanic that could, you know, would fix
00:46:28 --> 00:46:30 it in between my deliveries.
00:46:31 --> 00:46:31 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:46:31 --> 00:46:33 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Like I, I'd do a delivery
00:46:33 --> 00:46:34 and I'd drop it off and he'd.
00:46:34 --> 00:46:37 Have for the weekend, we'd have no vehicle for the weekend.
00:46:37 --> 00:46:41 Just be home moving fence and pick it up the following week and be
00:46:41 --> 00:46:42 able to make the next delivery.
00:46:43 --> 00:46:43 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh Yeah.
00:46:43 --> 00:46:43 Yeah.
00:46:44 --> 00:46:45 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah, so we talked about like
00:46:45 --> 00:46:48 what, what quality of life we would want to do, right.
00:46:48 --> 00:46:51 What, what, what would be important for us?
00:46:51 --> 00:46:51 And yeah.
00:46:51 --> 00:46:53 That's really what it came down to is right.
00:46:53 --> 00:46:57 You just trying to think like, okay, how do we want life to be in the future
00:46:58 --> 00:47:03 for us, you know, for our family now, for our kids in the long-term future,
00:47:03 --> 00:47:09 what, what skills and what type of life do we wanna be preparing them for?
00:47:10 --> 00:47:16 And so it was, you know, moving to a more of a grassland eco, you know,
00:47:16 --> 00:47:23 you know, ecology and and being more involved in, in those occupations, the,
00:47:23 --> 00:47:26 the sheep and the cattle and, you know.
00:47:27 --> 00:47:30 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Now, how long have you been in Kansas?
00:47:31 --> 00:47:35 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: We moved here last March, so it's been about
00:47:35 --> 00:47:35 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, so
00:47:36 --> 00:47:36 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: 13 months.
00:47:37 --> 00:47:37 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: yeah.
00:47:37 --> 00:47:38 So a little over a year.
00:47:38 --> 00:47:39 I thought it was a little bit shorter.
00:47:40 --> 00:47:43 So as you think about your move and how things are going for you
00:47:43 --> 00:47:47 now, and think about in Maine when you were considering this move,
00:47:47 --> 00:47:51 do you, do you think it happened right when it should have happened?
00:47:51 --> 00:47:55 Or do you wish you'd pushed maybe harder to have it happen Sooner?
00:47:56 --> 00:47:58 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Like if would, do I think
00:47:59 --> 00:48:00 we should have moved sooner?
00:48:00 --> 00:48:00 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yes.
00:48:01 --> 00:48:03 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: No, I don't think we need to move.
00:48:03 --> 00:48:04 I think it was just right.
00:48:04 --> 00:48:04 Yeah.
00:48:04 --> 00:48:04 Yeah.
00:48:05 --> 00:48:08 We got a level of custom grazing.
00:48:08 --> 00:48:12 Yeah, we, we, we, we had just kind of gotten into custom grazing.
00:48:12 --> 00:48:12 Yeah.
00:48:13 --> 00:48:14 It was the, and we.
00:48:15 --> 00:48:17 We really liked selling food.
00:48:17 --> 00:48:21 We, like, we always think of ourselves as food producers and being, you
00:48:21 --> 00:48:25 know, that's, you know, we're soil stewards and food producers foremost.
00:48:25 --> 00:48:31 But the direct to market, which was our bread and butter for a long time it
00:48:31 --> 00:48:34 became just, you know, challenging labor
00:48:34 --> 00:48:39 wise to fulfill all the orders, all the marketing, the communication with
00:48:39 --> 00:48:42 all the d as, as the business grew and we had more and more customers,
00:48:43 --> 00:48:45 it d demanded more and more time that.
00:48:45 --> 00:48:51 And so the idea that we could just do custom grazing and have like a couple
00:48:51 --> 00:48:56 business to business customers and be able to make a big part of our income
00:48:56 --> 00:48:58 doing that seemed really interesting.
00:48:58 --> 00:49:03 So we, the last year in Maine, we custom grazed some sheep and some cattle for
00:49:03 --> 00:49:07 a couple different operations and.
00:49:08 --> 00:49:10 That was, that was like really good.
00:49:10 --> 00:49:16 They were, they were all mixed into one flirt of cow, our cows, our sheep
00:49:16 --> 00:49:21 and other people's cows and sheep that were okay to be run together.
00:49:21 --> 00:49:23 And it was just one big, one big mob.
00:49:23 --> 00:49:26 And, and, okay.
00:49:26 --> 00:49:33 And it was, sheep like es and lambs and u lambs and feeder lambs and cows and
00:49:33 --> 00:49:36 calves and some steers and heifer calves.
00:49:36 --> 00:49:41 And we, you know, we br we actually had a bull we know to breed
00:49:41 --> 00:49:42 some of the cows for a moment.
00:49:43 --> 00:49:43 Yeah.
00:49:43 --> 00:49:46 One of the custom graziers had a nurse cow and she'd put, she'd
00:49:46 --> 00:49:47 grafted four calves onto it.
00:49:47 --> 00:49:50 It was a jersey dairy operation.
00:49:50 --> 00:49:50 Oh yeah.
00:49:50 --> 00:49:52 And she'd grafted four c calves on it.
00:49:52 --> 00:49:54 And that was out there with them mom, you
00:49:54 --> 00:49:56 know, the nurse mom, and our four calves.
00:49:56 --> 00:49:59 So it was just like, it was just, and, and three don and three donkeys.
00:49:59 --> 00:49:59 Right.
00:49:59 --> 00:50:00 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:50:00 --> 00:50:00 Yeah.
00:50:00 --> 00:50:02 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: it was like, just like so beautiful
00:50:02 --> 00:50:04 every day, like seeing all
00:50:04 --> 00:50:05 these different animals together.
00:50:06 --> 00:50:06 Right.
00:50:06 --> 00:50:10 And the, the sheep would use the cattle as shade structures and.
00:50:10 --> 00:50:14 And, and we got a level of, we went into the the Free Choice
00:50:14 --> 00:50:17 Mineral Cafe experiment on our own.
00:50:18 --> 00:50:22 And that was really nice because I did a spreadsheet on like what animal was
00:50:22 --> 00:50:25 using what, during what time of the year.
00:50:25 --> 00:50:28 And I gathered a lot of information, like whether they were putting on
00:50:28 --> 00:50:32 a, a coat, they would go through like, you know, sulfur or they
00:50:32 --> 00:50:33 were, it was fly fly season.
00:50:33 --> 00:50:36 They would eat more iodine, different things like
00:50:36 --> 00:50:36 that.
00:50:36 --> 00:50:38 And it was fascinating to
00:50:38 --> 00:50:39 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: That would be, yeah.
00:50:39 --> 00:50:42 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: coming into here, we have experiments
00:50:42 --> 00:50:47 under our belt that possibly yeah, business owners wouldn't wanna
00:50:47 --> 00:50:48 try, but we have that knowledge
00:50:48 --> 00:50:49 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:50:49 --> 00:50:50 Yeah.
00:50:50 --> 00:50:51 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: had, I recently actually, this just
00:50:51 --> 00:50:54 this morning, like in preparation for talking with you, I was thinking about.
00:50:55 --> 00:51:01 What if we just decided to move instead of moving to Maine instead of, we had
00:51:02 --> 00:51:07 thought about applying to jobs on ranches out west, and I think we gained so much
00:51:07 --> 00:51:12 information, just so much experience in trying to do our own thing and, and
00:51:13 --> 00:51:16 learn the hard way than just go right.
00:51:16 --> 00:51:17 To becoming an employee
00:51:17 --> 00:51:18 for someone else.
00:51:18 --> 00:51:21 Well, like you're saying, like the paradigm shifts because
00:51:21 --> 00:51:23 there's a lot of people who say, well, you can't do it that way.
00:51:23 --> 00:51:24 You have to do it this way.
00:51:24 --> 00:51:24 Right.
00:51:25 --> 00:51:28 And so you, when you're trying something on your own, you're like,
00:51:28 --> 00:51:32 well, this is all I have, or this is, this is what I'm interested in.
00:51:32 --> 00:51:33 I wanna learn more about that.
00:51:33 --> 00:51:35 So you get to try to try things on your own.
00:51:35 --> 00:51:36 Yeah.
00:51:36 --> 00:51:38 Which not everybody's willing to try those things.
00:51:38 --> 00:51:41 Well, it's, it's harder to do when you're an employee if the, if
00:51:41 --> 00:51:47 your boss, you know, or you know, you, it's just the, it's just more
00:51:47 --> 00:51:48 challenging to take those risks.
00:51:49 --> 00:51:49 Right.
00:51:50 --> 00:51:50 And
00:51:50 --> 00:51:50 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: it is.
00:51:50 --> 00:51:55 Even, even when you think about, so for instance, in my situation, we
00:51:55 --> 00:52:00 have dad's animals, we have dad and my animals, and we have my animals.
00:52:01 --> 00:52:05 With my animals, I can experiment or try whatever I want, and if it
00:52:05 --> 00:52:07 doesn't work, it only affects me.
00:52:08 --> 00:52:10 So, yeah, that, that's a a great point there.
00:52:11 --> 00:52:13 Let's transition just a little bit and talk about what
00:52:13 --> 00:52:15 you're doing in Kansas now.
00:52:15 --> 00:52:16 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
00:52:16 --> 00:52:20 So, I got hired by Sage Asin at new business.
00:52:20 --> 00:52:25 He started in, I guess last year called Regen, LLC.
00:52:25 --> 00:52:33 And I am managing a, the Kansas unit for region LLC here in Healy.
00:52:34 --> 00:52:38 And it's, it's pretty much a hundred percent custom grazing.
00:52:39 --> 00:52:43 There are a few of the sheep that the parent company ask in land and
00:52:43 --> 00:52:46 livestock still own, but most of them.
00:52:46 --> 00:52:50 Most of the sheep that we have here are all custom grazed, but they're owned by
00:52:51 --> 00:52:53 outside investors or people who wanna
00:52:53 --> 00:52:57 own sheep and, and region gets paid to take care of them.
00:52:57 --> 00:53:01 So, we've, and then we run stockers.
00:53:01 --> 00:53:04 It was, it last year was all steers in the summertime.
00:53:05 --> 00:53:09 And so in about two weeks, two or three weeks now, the, the steers
00:53:09 --> 00:53:10 will be arriving again this year.
00:53:11 --> 00:53:17 So we last year we had about a thousand sheep and goats over the summer and
00:53:17 --> 00:53:17 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:53:19 --> 00:53:22 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: and over the, the, the steers left
00:53:22 --> 00:53:29 and in September and then we started getting in more sheep and the goats left.
00:53:29 --> 00:53:34 And so over the winter we had almost four, 5 sheep, like
00:53:34 --> 00:53:37 4 sheep over the winter here.
00:53:37 --> 00:53:39 Three different bands.
00:53:39 --> 00:53:48 We had adult wool, a adult hair, sheep a band of like 1500 or so hair uams, so
00:53:48 --> 00:53:50 young uams that we were not breeding.
00:53:50 --> 00:53:54 And, and then a band of wool sheep as well.
00:53:54 --> 00:53:59 So, we, we've shipped some of those to, so Sage has he's managing a
00:53:59 --> 00:54:01 ranch in Nebraska and Wyoming.
00:54:02 --> 00:54:06 And so some of those sheep have gone on to different places, and I think mostly
00:54:06 --> 00:54:08 they've gone to the, the unit in Nebraska.
00:54:09 --> 00:54:14 And so right now we have around 2200 sheep here.
00:54:14 --> 00:54:20 And that's these, their current plan is they will be all be here for the season.
00:54:20 --> 00:54:25 We've got the help of two Peruvian guys, awesome guys that are just
00:54:25 --> 00:54:30 work really hard for us to manage the sheep and they're so much fun.
00:54:30 --> 00:54:32 We, we really love working with them.
00:54:33 --> 00:54:36 And they, they do whatever we ask 'em to do.
00:54:36 --> 00:54:40 It's really awesome and, and we've all taken up the, you know,
00:54:41 --> 00:54:43 learning Spanish to, so we can
00:54:43 --> 00:54:44 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:54:44 --> 00:54:45 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: communicate with them, which was,
00:54:45 --> 00:54:50 I personally never had any, any interest in learning another language.
00:54:50 --> 00:54:54 But it's definitely and if they say you can't learn a language when you're
00:54:54 --> 00:54:57 40, you can just, immersion helps.
00:54:58 --> 00:54:59 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yes it would.
00:54:59 --> 00:54:59 Yeah.
00:54:59 --> 00:55:01 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Nick was like speaking Spanish
00:55:01 --> 00:55:02 right away and I was like, wow.
00:55:02 --> 00:55:07 And I went through 12 years of Spanish in, in school and I felt like I could remember
00:55:07 --> 00:55:10 a few words, but I couldn't speak it.
00:55:11 --> 00:55:12 So it's really nice.
00:55:12 --> 00:55:16 My kids are out there with them and they're learning the language and and
00:55:16 --> 00:55:19 you know, my kids have always asked to learn another language, so it's,
00:55:19 --> 00:55:20 it's quite, quite nice to have that.
00:55:20 --> 00:55:21 Yep.
00:55:21 --> 00:55:22 So we.
00:55:22 --> 00:55:26 The, the steers are run on native pastures and the sheep are run
00:55:26 --> 00:55:28 on native pastures when possible.
00:55:28 --> 00:55:31 We, it's all, it's all leased land here in
00:55:31 --> 00:55:32 Kansas.
00:55:32 --> 00:55:37 And so most of the winter, the sheep were grazing stubble oat
00:55:37 --> 00:55:39 not oats corn and milo stubble.
00:55:39 --> 00:55:45 And and then in the summertime our, our main landlord will, and actually
00:55:45 --> 00:55:50 another, we've gotten some connections with some other landlords who are
00:55:50 --> 00:55:52 planting cover crops for us to graze.
00:55:52 --> 00:56:00 So learning a lot about how to graze cover crops and with sheep and and and, and a
00:56:00 --> 00:56:02 lot about the native grasses here too.
00:56:02 --> 00:56:06 Like it's just completely different grasses than in the north, northeast and
00:56:06 --> 00:56:10 the light, not only different species, but the lifecycles when, you know,
00:56:10 --> 00:56:13 like when you're gonna get the most growth out of the, the livestock
00:56:13 --> 00:56:18 on the native grasses and you know, what, what can stockpile and, you
00:56:18 --> 00:56:24 know, how if are they gonna, you know, appropriate times to graze stockpile.
00:56:24 --> 00:56:26 And so we're, we're just like, sponging it up 'cause there's
00:56:26 --> 00:56:27 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:56:27 --> 00:56:27 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: learn.
00:56:27 --> 00:56:27 Yeah.
00:56:28 --> 00:56:30 We have our experience, but there's so much down here that's
00:56:30 --> 00:56:32 different and, and good way.
00:56:32 --> 00:56:33 Yeah.
00:56:33 --> 00:56:34 And it's all spread out.
00:56:34 --> 00:56:39 Like even our native range pieces are, we have a, we have 1700 acres
00:56:39 --> 00:56:44 of native range that's, it's like an amazing piece that the landowner
00:56:44 --> 00:56:46 had set up previous where it's.
00:56:47 --> 00:56:50 It's all broken up into strips with high tensile and
00:56:50 --> 00:56:51 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:56:51 --> 00:56:54 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: points every 600 feet with like,
00:56:55 --> 00:56:59 like very good water flow, like 30 gallons a minute, water flow.
00:57:00 --> 00:57:04 So that for the stockers, that's like a great setup to be able to do daily moves.
00:57:04 --> 00:57:08 Most of the, most of the time last year I was doing twice a day moves with this,
00:57:08 --> 00:57:09 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
00:57:10 --> 00:57:12 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And but like I was saying that we're, we're
00:57:12 --> 00:57:17 kind of spread out like the, the sheep graze all over and we have got some land
00:57:17 --> 00:57:23 10 miles to the north, and so, we'll, we walk the sheep up up there to do that.
00:57:23 --> 00:57:28 There's the, the, the Milo and corn grazing is all separated and some of
00:57:28 --> 00:57:29 it has water and some of it doesn't.
00:57:29 --> 00:57:34 So we, the guys haul water with a thousand gallon water tanks to, to
00:57:34 --> 00:57:37 get water to the sheep where if they don't, aren't close to a water point.
00:57:39 --> 00:57:43 And they, you know, I've pretty much insisted they do like at the.
00:57:44 --> 00:57:49 You know, the, at the most, I mean, I tried, I want them to do everyday moves
00:57:49 --> 00:57:50 to move 'em with the animals every day.
00:57:50 --> 00:57:52 But sometimes just labor wise, it doesn't
00:57:53 --> 00:57:53 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
00:57:53 --> 00:57:54 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: you know?
00:57:54 --> 00:57:58 They probably average more every other day, moves and then occasionally they
00:57:58 --> 00:58:00 might do a three day paddock or something.
00:58:00 --> 00:58:04 But we try a shoot to have 'em do everyday moves with the sheep, which
00:58:04 --> 00:58:09 is, it's so much better for the sheep and, and the land to have the sheep
00:58:09 --> 00:58:13 having access to fresh feed every day instead of trying to get, you know, get
00:58:13 --> 00:58:15 one more day on this piece of ground.
00:58:15 --> 00:58:20 And really notice, like, if, when, when you they do that, that's when like you'll,
00:58:20 --> 00:58:22 seems like you'll have more deaths happen.
00:58:22 --> 00:58:23 And,
00:58:23 --> 00:58:27 and the animals just thrive a lot better if they have that access to a fresh bite.
00:58:27 --> 00:58:28 They didn't have to.
00:58:28 --> 00:58:31 It's not somebody's second, second, choice.
00:58:31 --> 00:58:34 It's their fir, you know, first choice bite every day.
00:58:34 --> 00:58:35 So,
00:58:35 --> 00:58:38 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: when, when you think about the change from Maine and
00:58:38 --> 00:58:43 scaling up to that many animals, 'cause you went from a, a much smaller amount
00:58:43 --> 00:58:47 of larger mammals to much larger numbers.
00:58:47 --> 00:58:49 What was the biggest change with that scale change?
00:58:50 --> 00:58:50 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Hmm.
00:58:51 --> 00:58:56 Well, I mean, definitely with a sheep, it's like, you, you, don't,
00:58:56 --> 00:58:58 you can't focus on individuals.
00:58:59 --> 00:59:01 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: It's much tougher to count him, isn't it?
00:59:01 --> 00:59:03 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: you, you, you have, you where you're
00:59:03 --> 00:59:04 really looking at the whole group.
00:59:05 --> 00:59:08 You do need to pick out, like you need to look for the, the ones that
00:59:08 --> 00:59:12 are falling behind and, and, you know, pick out the skinny ones.
00:59:13 --> 00:59:21 And like we, we never kept a, like a, like a feedlot situation in Maine and.
00:59:21 --> 00:59:24 Always just kept them healthy by moving them every
00:59:24 --> 00:59:25 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yes.
00:59:25 --> 00:59:27 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: and having access to green grass
00:59:27 --> 00:59:31 and then it's just a di it was very different co context here.
00:59:32 --> 00:59:38 If we notice an animal that's not doing well for any reason, pretty
00:59:38 --> 00:59:41 much it comes to it, the corral kind.
00:59:41 --> 00:59:43 I don't know if he, it's really visible behind us and not behind our house.
00:59:44 --> 00:59:48 And then it will get, you know, if it's something that we wanna keep, then it'll
00:59:48 --> 00:59:50 just get rehabilitated and go back out.
00:59:51 --> 00:59:54 Often they are, they're culls and we're just trying to keep 'em
00:59:54 --> 00:59:56 alive until we can get 'em sold.
00:59:57 --> 00:59:58 So we didn't have that in Maine.
00:59:59 --> 01:00:02 It's definitely a, we, we did call and we cu heavily.
01:00:02 --> 01:00:03 We did call in
01:00:03 --> 01:00:06 Maine, but they, they would often go right to it, right to the butcher.
01:00:06 --> 01:00:08 We were 15 minutes to a butcher shop, and
01:00:08 --> 01:00:11 we could just bring 'em right from the field to the butcher shop.
01:00:12 --> 01:00:14 Now we try to fill a trailer before we send right.
01:00:14 --> 01:00:15 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
01:00:15 --> 01:00:17 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: It's just a little more challenging that way.
01:00:18 --> 01:00:18 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
01:00:19 --> 01:00:23 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: But yeah, diff it's pretty similar.
01:00:23 --> 01:00:25 I mean, you're just making bigger, bigger paddocks in anyways.
01:00:25 --> 01:00:25 Yeah.
01:00:25 --> 01:00:26 Bigger, bigger
01:00:26 --> 01:00:26 paddocks.
01:00:26 --> 01:00:30 The water struggles can be real when you have a hot thirsty day
01:00:30 --> 01:00:34 and you've got 800 steers trying to push their way into a water trough.
01:00:34 --> 01:00:38 But it's pretty much similar, as long as you can,
01:00:40 --> 01:00:42 you know, make the adequate space.
01:00:43 --> 01:00:47 I was really surprised when last spring when the steers got dropped off here.
01:00:47 --> 01:00:49 I was like, there's no grass grow.
01:00:50 --> 01:00:51 'cause it's like, you know, this
01:00:51 --> 01:00:52 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
01:00:52 --> 01:00:53 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: we different, a lot, a lot of buffalo
01:00:53 --> 01:00:58 grass, which is very short grass, but, but really amazing in so many ways.
01:00:58 --> 01:01:01 And you know, we were used to grass that was like up to here some parts of the
01:01:01 --> 01:01:02 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
01:01:02 --> 01:01:04 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: it was like, you know, oh my gosh,
01:01:04 --> 01:01:05 they're gonna be complaining.
01:01:05 --> 01:01:07 And they didn't, the Angus were out on the
01:01:07 --> 01:01:07 pasture and.
01:01:08 --> 01:01:10 Them 1, 2, 3 times a day.
01:01:10 --> 01:01:14 And they would never even complain though, just when they were, when they were
01:01:14 --> 01:01:15 ready for a move, they were ready for a
01:01:15 --> 01:01:15 move.
01:01:15 --> 01:01:20 But once they learned that, you know, they were gonna stay in the fence,
01:01:20 --> 01:01:25 I, and you know, and they knew that I was gonna come back and move them.
01:01:25 --> 01:01:29 There was really very little ever had a problem with the fence.
01:01:29 --> 01:01:32 It, what did single strand poly braid.
01:01:32 --> 01:01:36 And occasionally I'd come in the morning and they'd be one out and
01:01:36 --> 01:01:39 he'd just be milling around trying to figure out how to get back in.
01:01:39 --> 01:01:42 You know, he probably got pushed out somewhere along the way and and he
01:01:42 --> 01:01:44 wouldn't, didn't, they never left.
01:01:44 --> 01:01:47 Out of the 800 that we brought, I think last year we lost three.
01:01:48 --> 01:01:48 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
01:01:48 --> 01:01:51 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: I got ex, I had never had any experience
01:01:51 --> 01:01:56 with using a dart gun and darting cattle with, you know, just do,
01:01:56 --> 01:01:59 doing a little doctoring if we saw something, either a foot rott or like
01:01:59 --> 01:02:01 a pink eye or something like that.
01:02:02 --> 01:02:07 And so, I don't know, I used a dozen darts or something, may, you
01:02:07 --> 01:02:10 know, probably not much more than a dozen darts over the season.
01:02:10 --> 01:02:14 And had three losses over the season.
01:02:14 --> 01:02:16 Just, you know, the, the they call 'em ballers.
01:02:17 --> 01:02:22 The, the the, these were all, all the steers and they, occasionally they would.
01:02:23 --> 01:02:28 They'd pick one that was, they'd start riding and they'd ride
01:02:28 --> 01:02:30 him until he wasn't doing well.
01:02:30 --> 01:02:31 And so I, by the end of the
01:02:31 --> 01:02:35 season, I figured out how to, how to separate those ballers
01:02:35 --> 01:02:37 into the paddock behind.
01:02:37 --> 01:02:40 They just, I just have 'em follow and separately, and occasionally
01:02:40 --> 01:02:44 they were, they didn't like being by themselves, so you had to have
01:02:44 --> 01:02:45 at least two or three together.
01:02:45 --> 01:02:48 Otherwise they'd just try to jump the fence to get back in with the group.
01:02:48 --> 01:02:49 And then
01:02:49 --> 01:02:49 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yes.
01:02:50 --> 01:02:51 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: like a death sentence.
01:02:51 --> 01:02:55 They'd, they would, you know, just get ridden more if they did that.
01:02:55 --> 01:02:57 So, you know, yeah.
01:02:57 --> 01:03:02 But by, by the end, I, you know, I think that I had a group of like five ballers
01:03:02 --> 01:03:07 that I had separated out into the, to the, the back paddock and yeah, when
01:03:07 --> 01:03:09 they, when I was like constantly nervous.
01:03:09 --> 01:03:12 'cause you can't count 800 steers in a
01:03:12 --> 01:03:12 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Right?
01:03:13 --> 01:03:14 Yes.
01:03:14 --> 01:03:16 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: like, ah, I, I, geez, I
01:03:16 --> 01:03:17 hope none are missing.
01:03:18 --> 01:03:20 I hope they're all there when we ship out.
01:03:20 --> 01:03:22 We had ship out, we had couple, we had a couple of events.
01:03:22 --> 01:03:24 We had a big flash flood at one point.
01:03:24 --> 01:03:24 Yeah.
01:03:24 --> 01:03:24 We had a big, which
01:03:24 --> 01:03:25 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, no.
01:03:25 --> 01:03:26 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: of fence everywhere.
01:03:26 --> 01:03:27 Yeah.
01:03:27 --> 01:03:28 It was a big storm.
01:03:28 --> 01:03:32 And we, and, and it, and I just, if it, if I had been anywhere else on the
01:03:32 --> 01:03:33 ranch, it wouldn't have been the problem.
01:03:33 --> 01:03:35 But I was down in a little valley,
01:03:36 --> 01:03:38 the range is filled up with water so
01:03:38 --> 01:03:39 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yes.
01:03:39 --> 01:03:40 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: wash, washed out my poly braid,
01:03:40 --> 01:03:45 washed out the barbed wire fence against the adjoining ranch.
01:03:45 --> 01:03:49 And so I went on a Sunday morning to go check on him and they had,
01:03:49 --> 01:03:52 they were leaving the paddock to go into other paddocks on our ranch
01:03:52 --> 01:03:55 and they were leaving the ranch going onto the adjoining ranch.
01:03:56 --> 01:04:00 And I was there by myself trying to gather 'em all back up and Yep.
01:04:00 --> 01:04:05 And I finally, you know, took all morning, but I got 'em all gathered back up.
01:04:05 --> 01:04:07 But, you know, for the rest of the season I was like, man, I hope, but the
01:04:07 --> 01:04:09 thing is the neighbors here are so good.
01:04:10 --> 01:04:10 Like, if
01:04:10 --> 01:04:14 any cattle get out, like people are calling me, you know, not,
01:04:16 --> 01:04:17 not usually, not even my cattle.
01:04:17 --> 01:04:18 Like, they're like,
01:04:18 --> 01:04:19 Hey, I've got some cattle on my ranch.
01:04:19 --> 01:04:20 Are these your cattle?
01:04:20 --> 01:04:22 And I'd be like, oh no, those aren't mine.
01:04:23 --> 01:04:23 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh yeah.
01:04:23 --> 01:04:25 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: and you know, they send a picture or something
01:04:25 --> 01:04:27 and I could confirm they weren't mine.
01:04:27 --> 01:04:27 And yeah.
01:04:27 --> 01:04:29 Yeah, it's a nice small community.
01:04:29 --> 01:04:29 So
01:04:29 --> 01:04:30 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, very good.
01:04:30 --> 01:04:31 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: yeah, you know, if, I've always
01:04:31 --> 01:04:35 felt like if, if a steer got outta my neighbor's property, they
01:04:35 --> 01:04:36 were gonna let me know, you know?
01:04:36 --> 01:04:37 And
01:04:37 --> 01:04:42 you know, sure enough, when they shipped they were all there, all but the three
01:04:42 --> 01:04:44 that had died, it was, it was awesome.
01:04:44 --> 01:04:45 So.
01:04:45 --> 01:04:46 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Well, very good.
01:04:47 --> 01:04:51 Nick and Sarah, it's time we transition to our famous four questions, same four
01:04:51 --> 01:04:53 questions we ask of all our guests.
01:04:54 --> 01:04:59 Our first question, what is your favorite grazing grass related book or resource?
01:05:02 --> 01:05:05 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Well, I books, I always
01:05:05 --> 01:05:07 go to holistic management.
01:05:07 --> 01:05:08 I'm a big fan of Alan Savory.
01:05:08 --> 01:05:13 And as a family we always really enjoyed watching Greg Judy's
01:05:14 --> 01:05:18 podcast and really love listening to him talk about grazing and yeah.
01:05:21 --> 01:05:22 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Sarah, you have anything to add on that?
01:05:24 --> 01:05:26 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: I really enjoyed Dr.
01:05:26 --> 01:05:29 Fred PSA's book on nourishment as far
01:05:29 --> 01:05:33 as, you know, keeping the animals healthy and having them, the
01:05:33 --> 01:05:36 babies with their mothers watching what to eat and things like that.
01:05:36 --> 01:05:41 It's, that's, that's an added bonus into the world of like
01:05:41 --> 01:05:42 moving your cattle every day.
01:05:42 --> 01:05:42 And I think it
01:05:42 --> 01:05:48 adds on to a lot of what Alan Savory and even Greg Judy say about the animals, so.
01:05:48 --> 01:05:48 Mm-hmm.
01:05:48 --> 01:05:49 It's
01:05:49 --> 01:05:50 nice how it all works together sometimes.
01:05:51 --> 01:05:51 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: it is.
01:05:51 --> 01:05:53 And excellent resources there.
01:05:54 --> 01:05:59 I've been wanting to read nourishment for a long time and I recently was made aware
01:05:59 --> 01:06:02 there's a audio book, so I'm actually listening to the audio version of it.
01:06:02 --> 01:06:04 So yeah.
01:06:04 --> 01:06:04 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Good.
01:06:05 --> 01:06:06 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Our second question, what's your
01:06:06 --> 01:06:08 favorite tool for the farm?
01:06:10 --> 01:06:11 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Probably poly braid.
01:06:13 --> 01:06:13 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: I think
01:06:14 --> 01:06:14 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Step in posts,
01:06:15 --> 01:06:18 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: yeah, with, without those, it's hard
01:06:18 --> 01:06:19 to do what you do each day.
01:06:20 --> 01:06:22 yeah, What would you tell someone?
01:06:22 --> 01:06:23 Just getting started.
01:06:25 --> 01:06:26 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Figure out how to keep your animals on
01:06:26 --> 01:06:33 the smallest possible space and move 'em every day and, and do the experiment.
01:06:34 --> 01:06:34 Yeah.
01:06:34 --> 01:06:36 De decision fatigue can be real.
01:06:36 --> 01:06:39 And, and you have to, you have to fail.
01:06:39 --> 01:06:40 You have to fail.
01:06:40 --> 01:06:40 It's
01:06:40 --> 01:06:43 just like, if you know, I'm gonna get up in the morning and I'm
01:06:43 --> 01:06:47 gonna make a decision and I'm gonna fail, and, and then that's okay.
01:06:47 --> 01:06:49 It's not a bad decision, it's just it information.
01:06:50 --> 01:06:52 Then just make that decision and know you're gonna fail, and
01:06:52 --> 01:06:55 then do the next thing the next day that makes you fail again
01:06:55 --> 01:06:56 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: yes.
01:06:56 --> 01:06:58 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And just keep failing until you realize
01:06:58 --> 01:07:00 like your failures don't define you.
01:07:00 --> 01:07:04 It's, it's the continuing to get up the next day and, and, have
01:07:04 --> 01:07:06 progress in the right direction.
01:07:06 --> 01:07:07 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
01:07:07 --> 01:07:09 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: gotta have your, you've gotta have
01:07:09 --> 01:07:14 your, what you're aiming for, you have to figure out what your goal
01:07:14 --> 01:07:16 is as a family, as an individual.
01:07:16 --> 01:07:18 Yeah, have a, have a goal.
01:07:18 --> 01:07:19 Yeah, definitely.
01:07:19 --> 01:07:22 And like, figure out, think, spend some time thinking about
01:07:22 --> 01:07:26 what your goals are and then just start moving to towards them.
01:07:26 --> 01:07:29 And when you fail, one small step because you're gonna Yeah.
01:07:29 --> 01:07:31 Get back up again and move towards that goal.
01:07:31 --> 01:07:31 Yeah.
01:07:31 --> 01:07:35 Well, and constantly reevaluate, you know, are we move closer to
01:07:35 --> 01:07:36 the goal or further away, right.
01:07:36 --> 01:07:39 There's a lot of distractions on a farm, right?
01:07:39 --> 01:07:43 You can have a random animal who just dies and it's, maybe it's one out
01:07:43 --> 01:07:45 of a hundred, or even one outta 20.
01:07:45 --> 01:07:48 And you can get really distracted about that one animal and think, I failed this
01:07:48 --> 01:07:51 one animal and the rest are thriving.
01:07:51 --> 01:07:52 And in the process of.
01:07:53 --> 01:07:55 Trying to fix that one animal.
01:07:55 --> 01:07:58 Not that that's not important, but you can forget about the
01:07:58 --> 01:08:00 rest of it's very easy to do.
01:08:00 --> 01:08:01 We've done it so many
01:08:01 --> 01:08:01 times.
01:08:02 --> 01:08:06 You know, you just, you forget about the whole picture and you go towards
01:08:06 --> 01:08:08 the one thing that's a distraction.
01:08:08 --> 01:08:13 And so we often think about things in an analogy of a motorcycle.
01:08:13 --> 01:08:14 And I don't drive a motorcycle,
01:08:15 --> 01:08:15 but I've heard it.
01:08:15 --> 01:08:20 If you're driving in the road and you see a pothole and you're
01:08:20 --> 01:08:22 looking at that pothole trying to avoid it, you're gonna hit the
01:08:22 --> 01:08:23 pothole,
01:08:23 --> 01:08:24 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yes.
01:08:24 --> 01:08:24 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: right?
01:08:24 --> 01:08:28 So you just have to look at where you wanna go and see the pothole,
01:08:28 --> 01:08:29 acknowledge it's there, right?
01:08:29 --> 01:08:31 It does the pothole, but don't keep looking at it.
01:08:31 --> 01:08:33 Look at the things you wanna get to.
01:08:33 --> 01:08:34 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
01:08:34 --> 01:08:35 Excellent advice.
01:08:35 --> 01:08:36 Both.
01:08:36 --> 01:08:36 Yes.
01:08:37 --> 01:08:39 And lastly, where can others find out more about you?
01:08:41 --> 01:08:43 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Well, we do have a YouTube channel
01:08:43 --> 01:08:47 that we have neglected for the past year, but we, we, at any point
01:08:47 --> 01:08:51 we could, we actually have uploaded a few things in the past year, but I don't
01:08:51 --> 01:08:53 think our website is active anymore.
01:08:53 --> 01:08:57 Our YouTube channel is Jackson Regeneration Family now.
01:08:57 --> 01:08:57 It was
01:08:57 --> 01:09:01 Jackson Regeneration Farm, but we switched to Jackson Regenerational
01:09:01 --> 01:09:05 family as a, since We aren't running our own business at this point.
01:09:05 --> 01:09:07 So yeah, that's probably the best
01:09:07 --> 01:09:07 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
01:09:07 --> 01:09:08 And we'll put a link.
01:09:10 --> 01:09:15 To the, the, to that in our show notes and before we get guys pulled up.
01:09:15 --> 01:09:18 So we're talking and Sarah says, Nick and I'm,
01:09:19 --> 01:09:21 I'm like, Nick sounds right.
01:09:21 --> 01:09:23 And then I looked at my paper and I'm like, wait, I got Mike.
01:09:24 --> 01:09:26 So I called you Mike, and a little bit Sarah calls you Nick again.
01:09:26 --> 01:09:28 I'm like, I've got something wrong.
01:09:28 --> 01:09:32 So I popped open in a new tab and I'm like, I have Nick there.
01:09:32 --> 01:09:34 Why did IW write Mike down?
01:09:34 --> 01:09:35 I don't know.
01:09:35 --> 01:09:37 So Nick, I apologize for that.
01:09:37 --> 01:09:38 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: you say it once and
01:09:38 --> 01:09:39 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, okay, good.
01:09:41 --> 01:09:42 Yeah.
01:09:43 --> 01:09:45 To wrap up, do you have a question for me?
01:09:46 --> 01:09:47 How do you keep names straight?
01:09:47 --> 01:09:48 I really don't know.
01:09:50 --> 01:09:50 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, geez.
01:09:51 --> 01:09:54 Well, so you work with your dad, it sounds like.
01:09:54 --> 01:09:55 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: I do, yes.
01:09:55 --> 01:09:57 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: And have, how's, how's that go?
01:09:57 --> 01:10:01 Like, do, is it, do you guys enjoy working with each other?
01:10:01 --> 01:10:05 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: I, I love the opportunity to work with him.
01:10:05 --> 01:10:10 And my dad is a Vietnam veteran and he is, when I say disabled,
01:10:10 --> 01:10:12 dad does tons of stuff.
01:10:12 --> 01:10:14 He's disabled, but he gets around with a walker.
01:10:15 --> 01:10:18 But when you say that, you're gonna think he's more fragile than he is.
01:10:18 --> 01:10:19 My dad's not fragile.
01:10:19 --> 01:10:22 I don't think anywhere anyone's ever thought dad's fragile.
01:10:24 --> 01:10:26 So we've worked together for years.
01:10:26 --> 01:10:28 I live two miles down the road from him.
01:10:28 --> 01:10:32 We have cat or he's got cattle that I manage.
01:10:32 --> 01:10:33 We have hair sheep together.
01:10:33 --> 01:10:36 And then I have goats and cattle on my own.
01:10:36 --> 01:10:38 But I talk to dad every day.
01:10:39 --> 01:10:41 We work on stuff together.
01:10:41 --> 01:10:45 Yesterday I complained to my wife that my dad roped me into doing something
01:10:45 --> 01:10:51 else that wasn't on my schedule, but I, I find that it's such an honor to be able,
01:10:51 --> 01:10:54 he can't do all that we do physically.
01:10:55 --> 01:11:00 And obviously he's older than me, so, you know, his age comes in there too.
01:11:00 --> 01:11:04 And it's such an honor to be able to help him do his goals because I
01:11:04 --> 01:11:08 know he's wanted to, to do this for years and we've done it for years,
01:11:08 --> 01:11:10 but he's not ready to, to give up.
01:11:10 --> 01:11:11 So I really enjoy it.
01:11:11 --> 01:11:16 Now when I say that it's really been a journey, because when I was 20 working
01:11:16 --> 01:11:21 with my dad or 25 working with my dad, it's a whole different environment
01:11:21 --> 01:11:24 now that I'm a little over 50.
01:11:24 --> 01:11:26 We won't say the exact years, but.
01:11:27 --> 01:11:31 I understand my place and I am more accepting that I'm
01:11:31 --> 01:11:33 able to help him get there.
01:11:33 --> 01:11:36 Now, on the conversely, he's more accepting of my crazy
01:11:36 --> 01:11:38 ideas and what I want to try.
01:11:38 --> 01:11:43 So we've both grown and, and I look at it and think, I've only
01:11:43 --> 01:11:45 got so many more years of this.
01:11:45 --> 01:11:47 I need to take advantage of it and enjoy it.
01:11:47 --> 01:11:48 So I, I love doing it.
01:11:48 --> 01:11:52 Working with family introduces a whole host of issues that you've
01:11:52 --> 01:11:55 gotta be able to work through and be honest and, and understand.
01:11:55 --> 01:11:57 Sometimes you gotta take a step back.
01:11:57 --> 01:12:01 As much as I enjoy working with dads, there's days he drives me crazy.
01:12:03 --> 01:12:04 It's just the way it is.
01:12:05 --> 01:12:05 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Definitely.
01:12:05 --> 01:12:06 For sure.
01:12:06 --> 01:12:07 That's wonderful.
01:12:07 --> 01:12:08 And he had a dairy farm when you were growing up.
01:12:08 --> 01:12:09 Is that
01:12:09 --> 01:12:10 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yes, yes.
01:12:10 --> 01:12:12 So, grew up, grew up on a dairy.
01:12:13 --> 01:12:17 I went to college and I was one of the smartest ones in my class at college.
01:12:17 --> 01:12:19 'cause I came home to dairy after college.
01:12:20 --> 01:12:24 Did that for a year, and then we sold out and he's ran.
01:12:24 --> 01:12:28 Then when we sold out, I went, I worked off the farm and he
01:12:29 --> 01:12:30 started running beef cattle.
01:12:30 --> 01:12:33 And then, I don't know about,
01:12:34 --> 01:12:35 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: what kind of dairy cows did you guys run
01:12:36 --> 01:12:37 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: we had Holsteins
01:12:37 --> 01:12:37 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: whole.
01:12:38 --> 01:12:41 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: We were, we were, I think the best
01:12:41 --> 01:12:47 way to describe it is kind of a pasture-based system, small dairy.
01:12:47 --> 01:12:50 We weren't grass-based because we weren't pushing grass into 'em.
01:12:50 --> 01:12:54 I did try, that's where I started my grass journey, trying to manage them
01:12:55 --> 01:12:58 and ran into all kinds of headaches and didn't know what I was doing.
01:12:58 --> 01:13:01 I still don't know what I'm doing, but I'm doing a little bit better now.
01:13:02 --> 01:13:05 But yeah, Holsteins and I love dairies
01:13:05 --> 01:13:06 daring.
01:13:06 --> 01:13:08 I'd love to get some jerseys now
01:13:08 --> 01:13:10 or a smaller breed.
01:13:10 --> 01:13:11 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: she's awesome.
01:13:11 --> 01:13:16 She's short statured and I didn't like intentionally see search out.
01:13:16 --> 01:13:19 There was a, there was a sale, a, I guess a dairy was going outta
01:13:19 --> 01:13:21 business in southern Kansas.
01:13:21 --> 01:13:25 And anyways, I got her from a friend who picked her up at the
01:13:25 --> 01:13:28 auction and she's fantastic and
01:13:28 --> 01:13:30 she won't, she won't eat any grain.
01:13:30 --> 01:13:31 Like I,
01:13:32 --> 01:13:38 I mean, I, I love the ideal of having a grass finished like a grass milk
01:13:38 --> 01:13:39 essentially.
01:13:39 --> 01:13:42 But I wanna make sure the cow keeps condition on her, but she
01:13:42 --> 01:13:43 won't eat any anyway.
01:13:43 --> 01:13:44 She's fantastic.
01:13:44 --> 01:13:45 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, well, good.
01:13:46 --> 01:13:48 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: eat mineral or salt either though.
01:13:48 --> 01:13:48 Right.
01:13:48 --> 01:13:48 So
01:13:48 --> 01:13:48 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh,
01:13:49 --> 01:13:50 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: there might be a problem down the line.
01:13:51 --> 01:13:56 We, we, we start to wonder if she had actually the way she, she's out on grass
01:13:56 --> 01:13:59 now a little bit as much as we can.
01:13:59 --> 01:14:03 And we actually wonder if she's actually grazed before the way
01:14:03 --> 01:14:04 she tries to eat the grass.
01:14:04 --> 01:14:05 She doesn't
01:14:05 --> 01:14:06 know how to get her tongue quite right.
01:14:06 --> 01:14:07 Like she,
01:14:07 --> 01:14:08 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: oh, yes.
01:14:08 --> 01:14:10 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: been fed a total mixed ration that has, that's
01:14:10 --> 01:14:13 had her, her salt and minerals included.
01:14:13 --> 01:14:14 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Oh, yeah,
01:14:14 --> 01:14:15 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: I don't know.
01:14:15 --> 01:14:18 We, you know, we don't have a lot of experience in that world,
01:14:18 --> 01:14:20 so, but it's just fascinating.
01:14:20 --> 01:14:21 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: yeah, yeah.
01:14:21 --> 01:14:25 Just have to observe her and make sure she maintains condition.
01:14:25 --> 01:14:26 See how it goes.
01:14:26 --> 01:14:26 Yeah.
01:14:26 --> 01:14:27 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: not much I can do about it.
01:14:27 --> 01:14:29 You can't force her to eat.
01:14:29 --> 01:14:31 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: Or yeah, you can lead a horse to water,
01:14:31 --> 01:14:32 but you can't make 'em drink.
01:14:32 --> 01:14:32 Yeah.
01:14:33 --> 01:14:34 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: But with her calf, we give her a
01:14:34 --> 01:14:38 little bit of barley and she takes it from us and she, so her calf is a
01:14:38 --> 01:14:40 heifer and is in fairly good condition
01:14:40 --> 01:14:44 and I, you know, the future is in the, the genetics future on, but
01:14:44 --> 01:14:44 yeah.
01:14:45 --> 01:14:45 But
01:14:46 --> 01:14:46 Yeah.
01:14:46 --> 01:14:47 they, they love the alfalfa.
01:14:48 --> 01:14:48 We we're
01:14:48 --> 01:14:48 totally new.
01:14:49 --> 01:14:50 We're new to alfalfa.
01:14:50 --> 01:14:53 There's not a lot of alfalfa in Maine and, and that was a learning experience
01:14:53 --> 01:14:54 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: oh, yes.
01:14:55 --> 01:14:55 Yeah.
01:14:55 --> 01:14:56 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Wow.
01:14:56 --> 01:14:57 It seems good stuff.
01:14:58 --> 01:14:58 cal_2_04-19-2025_081458: It is.
01:14:58 --> 01:14:59 It is.
01:14:59 --> 01:15:00 Very good stuff.
01:15:00 --> 01:15:04 Well, Nick and Sarah, really appreciate you coming on and sharing about
01:15:04 --> 01:15:07 your journey, your transition across country and how things are going.
01:15:08 --> 01:15:08 squadcaster-8j15_2_04-19-2025_081458: Yeah.
01:15:08 --> 01:15:09 You very much for having us.
01:15:09 --> 01:15:10 Thank you very much for having us.
01:15:10 --> 01:15:12 It's been been great talk to talk to you.
01:15:12 --> 01:15:15 Cal: Thank you for listening to this episode of the grazing grass podcast,
01:15:16 --> 01:15:20 where we bring you stories and insights into grass-based livestock production.
01:15:20 --> 01:15:23 If you're new here, we've got something just for you.
01:15:23 --> 01:15:25 Our new listener resource guide.
01:15:25 --> 01:15:29 Is packed with everything you need to get started on your listening
01:15:29 --> 01:15:32 journey with a grazing grass podcast.
01:15:32 --> 01:15:35 It gives you more information about the podcast about myself.
01:15:36 --> 01:15:37 And next steps.
01:15:38 --> 01:15:41 You can grab your free copy at grazinggrass.com
01:15:41 --> 01:15:42 slash guide.
01:15:43 --> 01:15:44 Don't miss out.
01:15:45 --> 01:15:47 And Hey, do you have a grazing story to share?
01:15:48 --> 01:15:52 We're always looking for passionate producers to feature on the show,
01:15:52 --> 01:15:57 whether you're just starting out or have years of experience your story matters.
01:15:58 --> 01:15:59 Head over to grazing grass.
01:15:59 --> 01:16:01 Dot com slash guest.
01:16:01 --> 01:16:04 To learn more and apply to be a guest.
01:16:04 --> 01:16:08 We'd love to share your journey with our growing community of grazers.
01:16:09 --> 01:16:10 Until next time.
01:16:11 --> 01:16:12 Keep on grazing grass.
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