e54. A Desert Rancher’s Journey with Javier Mesta

In this episode, Javier Mesta, a rancher from Chihuahua, Mexico, shares his inspiring journey of transforming a 3,000-acre desert ranch through high-density grazing. By effectively managing the land and avoiding overgrazing, Javier has increased his stocking rate by 2.5 times and plans to double it once more. He discusses the challenges and rewards of managing a ranch in a desert environment, the importance of proper grazing, and how high-density grazing can lead to better regeneration of grasslands and improved land value. Javier also shares his experience with obtaining carbon credits, the certification process, and the use of satellite technology to monitor carbon capture on individual ranches.

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Welcome to the Grasing Grass Podcast episode fifty four. We want everything to be fast. And when you’re talking about land, when you’re talking out the ground. The soil is not that fast. But if you have the patience to continue to do it to grace at high density, change your your cattle as many times as you can or you want, you will see results. You’re listening to the gracing grass podcast, helping grass farmers learn from grass farmers, and every episode features a grass farmer. And their operation. I’m your host, Cal Hardich.

On today’s episode, we have Javier Mesta, From Mexico sharing about ranching on his three thousand acres and the difference the high density grazing is making for him. We talk about his journey and what he’s doing with the high density grazing as well as carbon credits. Before we talk to Javier, Let’s do our ten seconds about my farm. And to be honest, I’m not gonna talk about my farm this week. Won’t talk about what’s coming up this week for me. I’m going to the Greg Judy Advanced Grazing School. I’m pretty excited to be going. I wanted to go for quite a while, but I will fill you in on it next week on the podcast. When you are listening to that, I will probably be close to on my way to going there or will be there. But enough about me, Let’s talk to Javier. Javier, we wanna welcome you to the grazing grass podcast. We’re excited you’re here today. Thank you, Kyle. Thank you so much for our keeping me the opportunity to share with all your audience. Oh, very good. Very good. So why don’t you just tell us a little bit about yourself? In your ranch. Just get us started. Yeah. Okay.

Well, I’m from Chihuahua, Mexico. We are in the desert of Mexico. And I’ve got a small range. It’s basically three thousand acre range. And when I for some parts of the world, they said three thousand acre huge ranch. But for Chihuahua, three thousand acres is nothing. It’s nothing. And you said earlier on three thousand acres when you first got, they said you could run a hundred head accounts. Exactly. Right. Totally totally soaked So it’s a small ranch and I bought it because I just love cattle. I love cattle. I love horses. And my dad taught me about this about this business because Ranching is a business. And — Yes. — so he taught me about it. And so when I got the opportunity to get it, I acquired it, and I got it in the dessert, up to dessert. Because where I got it is hot, a hundred and ten, a hundred and fifteen degrees in summer. It’s a very, very damage. Land at that time, but I just wanted to do it. And ever since I got it, I had in mind the mindset. How to regenerate thing and how to make it productive because cattle cattle just like any other business about productivity and about making it profitable. So that’s why I got into the ranch and just loving it.

I’m here from Chihuahua, Mexico. I’ve been here all my life. I had a chance to study in the United States for two years in Saint Luke, Missouri. And I’m an engineer by Professions. So I love manufacturing and I love ranching, which is what I learned from my dad. Those two business Very good. And you said you studied in Saint Louis? They studied in Chaminade College Prep in Cripple Course in Missouri? That was I’m fifteen to seventeen years old. And I had such a great time. I loved the United States. I wanted to go to college in the US, but my dad said, no, you come back. So I came I came back to Mexico.

So you mentioned a little bit, did your dad ranch as well? My dad used to ranch. Yes. He passed away now and used to have a very, very big ranch. And you see, that’s where I started to see how the ranching business started to go down as you see we always talk about the weather, how how the drought come more often than four. And rain is less regular and it used to be with less rain and less regularity. And so now the ranches have less grass to feed the cattle, less water, so it’s it’s going down and down. That that’s where I started to see that ever since my dad had the ranch.

And then I came up with this with this idea, I mean, which is not new, I mean, if you go back, it’s from the nineteen sixties, nineteen seventies when this — Oh, yes. — exactly what they started to work on on this matter, but it’s it’s something that people just don’t believe or people don’t wanna try it out. But I said, well, what the hell? I mean, If it works, great. If it doesn’t doesn’t work. Yeah. But you try. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah.

So when you You purchased the three thousand acres. You had this in mind. You thought I’m going to go forth. I’m gonna do high density crazy. I’m gonna get this set up and get go. Exactly ever since I saw the ranch, I said that’s what I’m gonna do because, I mean, you have you have two options to go either to a big ranch and try to get more cattle in But you know what? It’s just a wisdom. It’s I mean, go and invest that kind of money to land. I mean I mean, return on investment. Before ever. So I said, now I’m gonna do it otherwise. I’m just gonna go to a small range. I’m gonna try to make it profitable and make my ROI better and faster. So so that’s exactly what I did. Very good.

So you purchased your your ranch, three thousand acres. Tell us what it looked like when you bought it. It was it was a sad story. Actually, on my Instagram and my Facebook, There are some pictures there. No. It was it was so damaged. It was so damaged that I actually, the land, the ground, was kind of like a gray. Between gray and black. Oh, yeah. And the reason that happens is because it was an amber grace an understuck, which it might seem like something that is not right, but actually it is. Because when you have you don’t have enough cattle and the cattle is just selectively grazing, then you are overgrazing your land. And what’s Because they’re overgrazing those areas they love. They they overgrazed areas they love they don’t touch what they don’t love. So what they don’t love, it just starts to go I mean, are you familiar with the lichen stuff that black thing that goes on the on the ground, which actually starts to heal life. So that was the way the ranch was. He was he was all all full of lichen, congrats that the candied in touch was so old. But in some parts, there’s actually there actually wood. I mean, you you know that grass, it’s at the end, it turns into wood if it fits very old. So you could see the grass tough in the middle, he was dying. He was like, let’s say if he was a cake, but he was not a cake, he was a bun. Okay. So That’s so weird. Little, there was nothing because he was full of licking and and the grass was so old. She was dying. So that’s the way that all the whole range was.

Let me tell you something very interesting. I I got engaged into the carbon credits project. Oh, yes. And we’re in the process of a certifying our our credits and When they first because they go five years back, when they first saw with the satellite, my range I mean, he was so damaged that he was releasing carbon to the atmosphere. And after I started gracing with h d high density gracing, it just started to capture carbon again. So that was the image of the range, totally damaged, all grass, and and not much life. And now that story is just a different Oh, yeah. I have ninety patter, which are ninety patter with electric fence. And with poly wire, I break it into twelve hundred pack. So right now, we’re changing the cattle four times a day and — Oh, okay. — and so so is basically one thousand two hundred paddocks that we moved at cattle from one paddock to the other one. So I may just see how how the land, how the ground starts to change once once all the cattle is together and doing their herd effect. Yes. So it’s just changing dramatically.

I did I did a study about the Vasiles cover of the ranch. And — Yes. — it was ten percent Ten percent. Oh. Well, it was funny because I told a friend that I had a ranch, I had ten percent basal cover, and he said, Omen, that’s terrible. And I said, no, it’s great because I’ve got a lot of a lot of a lot of space to go up. Yes. That’s that’s a great way to look at that. Yes. So I said if we don’t ten percent I had a hundred cattle and a hundred cars gonna go easy. So now I have it. Two hundred and fifty. I think I’m going for the five hundred easily. Yes.

Now when you you talk about it was two pastors when you got it. Yeah. And you Did you immediately go in and put those ninety paddicks in? No. No. No.

I I started little by little. Actually, that’s one of the mistakes I made at the beginning. I tried to do it by myself, Oh, by myself? Oh, yes. And I did a a two barbed wire palette with I sure not. I just wasted my money. Because as you know, an electric fence, it costs you ten percent just in materials pop up. Barbed wire fence. And and that’s not included the wordmanship because doing the barbed wire fence, it just takes a lot more work to a deal. No. Yes. I did it. I shouldn’t have to.

And then I started to do in electrical fences little by little. First, it didn’t further apart, and then I started to spread any more. And so that’s how you got tonight. Tonight packs. So what? Fixed electrical? And now with the bubble wire, I can go to twelve hundred. So it’s fixed electrical.

Is it high tensile wire?


Yes. How many strands did you put? One. One. Yeah. One. You don’t you don’t need you don’t need more than one. That’s it. That’s it. What once you get the cattle to understand the the system and and and that if they go close, they’re gonna get electric shit. Right. They know so. So you just need one. That’s it.

And then you’re you’re subdividing that up further. You’re using poly brite or twine. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. And and it’s funny because it’s so so used to human that They just follow you and they know exactly when you’re gonna open for a new pastor because they know on the other side of the wire, there’s a fresh pattern. So so they’re just waiting to see when you’re gonna open.

Yes. They do, and especially with you doing four times. A day. Did you have you done four times a day the whole time? No. Actually, at the first, I started, like, once a day or was every two days at the beginning? Yes. And then I went up to twelve times. But you know what? That was too much. That was too much. And my workers and cowboys didn’t were able to handle it right. And and that’s I mean, the people is just basic foundation for this system. So if if they don’t do it right, they they will not handle the pass through correctly and your cattle will start to lose body condition. So that’s what happened to me. I mean, the grass was doing great, but the cattle cows were starting to lose body condition. I didn’t like it. So I said, you know what? Let’s go back to four changes a bit and let’s go to a hundred and twenty five caliber acre density. That’s good enough. That’s good enough to regenerate. I mean, the higher the better. But you know what? Who pays the bill? The cow. And if the cow is stuck here, I could buy a condition, you will have no calf to pay the bill, so that’s a surprise. No. No. No. No. Let let’s do let’s do both things. Let’s do correct.

Now with all those paddocks, how are you getting water everywhere? So so my ranch, it’s a is twelve kilometers. How many miles is that? It’s, like, eight miles, like, seven miles long. And so I have waterline all the way to the from from from the start, all the way to the end of the range, and and that’s how it changed the pattern. So I have so my cattle my cattle will they walk at the most one point five mile for water. That’s the most. Oh, yes. That’s the most. Which sounds like a long ways to me because that’s that’s much further, of course. Not grazing anything that the cows could walk a hundred one point five miles on. So k. K. Smaller area. How how do the cows handle walking that far? It might sound too much, but you have cows that might walk be walking four or five miles Yes. And you know what? It’s it’s not all the time because since I have the waterline all all the way to the ranch and then I have a movable water tank? Well, actually, you move it with a quad with a quad bike. So when they start racing, they start racing right next to the water tank, and then as they go further into the pattern. On on the longest the biggest part of the range, the the model will walk is one point five point five miles.

But before we go on into your cattle just a little bit, we’ve talked about the electric fence in in three thousand acres. You have a lot of electric fence. Yes. Do you have one Energizer running all that? Or do you have multiple Energizers? I have two Energizer. Big one and small one. And the big one is you can set up and actually you don’t have to move it much. It’s a big one and it has a solar panel and a battery. So so that’s the way it works. So the big one, you just set up in a place. We I have, like, in a set up a range. And now you just do a whole circuit. That’s it. It just goes. But I have a smaller one as a spare one just in case something happen. And for instance, right now where I got the bulls out of the cows. So this one, because I have the bulls farther up, further down, so they don’t get too close to the count. I have this small one with the bowl and then the other one for the whole the whole part of the range. So with two, it’s enough. Very good.

And just a little bit about your rain. From past guests on from your area, I know you all been pretty dry and only getting a few inches of rain a year — Yes. — about what have you received in the last year? On the last four years, an average of ten inches of rent a year. And that happens on mostly on three months, July, August, September. So that’s a rainy season. Sometimes we’ll get something in the beginning of spring seldom. And the situation here in the desert is that If it doesn’t rain right, like, let’s say, starting July, August when when it’s hot. And it starts to rain late September, October, then the grass just doesn’t grow. Just stay short because that’s when the when the morning starts to get cool. Oh, yes. So they just don’t grow. So when when when it rains correctly, like last year that it rained correctly. At the end of June, beginning of July, August, you a very good year because that’s when the when the grass grows more. Oh, yes. Yes.

And what kind of grasses do you have there. The main three grasses that I have is alkali Sacaton, and I got tooboss. So those two are hard grasses. Okay. Or on the teeth of the cap. And then I have I have sawgrass which is spare, but those were the those are the main three that I have. When I first started, the the grass was so hard. But what I got to understand is that it gets hard when you don’t know how to grace it. Because when you leave it for the cow, to selectively grace, then it starts to leave the ones that they don’t like. So it starts to get hotter and hotter every day. So now now that is being grazed correctly, they are not that hard. So those are the main three, the Achalica toned, the Boson de Salgrass. But now, I have seen and I’m starting to see some parts new different types of stuff.

Oh, yes. You know what? That’s exciting to work. That’s so excited when you still say, oh, man, I’ve never seen that before. I’ve never seen this one before. I’ve never seen this one before because that’s when you start see that the crown starts to regenerate.

Because you know Oh, yeah. You understand that that tiniards of ground. Is millions and millions of seeds. There are but there are two things. Even dirt that they have no life and also have the ground capping that even if the little steel wants to go out, just impossible for it. So when you start to see that, that’s when you see, okay, well, how the ground is starting to regenerate and he’s starting to have life and now look what’s happening. Oh, yes. It’s beautiful. It’s beautiful. It’s beautiful. And you know you know what kind of is very funny because I I just love wrenching and I and you know what? All the kind of wrenches, we must know something about agriculture. Even though we are not gonna crop, but we need to understand how our how our ranch can regenerate. Grow more grass so we can have more cattle and make more profit. Yes. And and when used to understand what happens to the The third convert soil is fascinating. It’s fascinating. Could you start to see things like first, when you start to see the change in color from white to brownish, and then you start to herf and then you start to see flowers and then yearly grasses and then the perennials coming. But when you understand what the processes of the regeneration is like every time I go to a ranch, like, I go with my kids, they said, dad, just just don’t stop fifty times before we get to the house. Because I just live and I explain him, I mean, I mean, you need to understand what’s going on because, you know, yes. You’re seeing the sick ziplings growing, that means that there’s millions going around the whole range. So those things are starting to paint. So it’s just like you say, it’s fascinate. It’s fascinating. Oh, it is.

What kind of cattle did you go with for your ranch? I started with Charbrite, then I change to angle. And now I have a breath. Maybe you’re familiar with the persona shown up by the South African cattle. And the reason why I brought that is because it is very, very well adapted to hot line. K? So So my bowls are half angles, half marzoni, and — Oh, okay. — and my cattle are I have I don’t care. I mean, I even have rodeo cows. Oh, yeah. Like cows and angles and hair force and and Charley and and it it does Bif Master and Care. As long as they perform well because I go by selection. I I don’t go by type of cow. I go by selection. A cow that performs well cattle that gives me a calf every year stays if not equal as easy as that. Right. Yeah. The important stuff are they productive for you? Extract I mean, I don’t fall in love with cows. I If they if they are productive, but if not, thank you so much. You become you become a cow cow. Ryan didn’t work for you.

So, with the mushrooms, are you are you really liking the influence of mushrooms on your calves? You know what? I’d like him very well. You can see their their hair. Okay. It’s more more brighter. They have a more vigor, the animal, and they have more inherited body condition. You can see it ever since they’re born. I mean, No. The difference. So so they are they are behaving very, very well. The new cows are growing the from my bowl. They’re doing very well. Very, very well. And you know what? I like smokehouse. I like small frame, three, three and a half of the most frame, not bigger than that? I believe that a cow cow and smaller the better because the faster it gets they fill up when they’re eating And at the end, it’s gonna deliver me one calves. I mean, maybe a little bit smaller than one, but so what? Really have one point five calves and or or two than one. So that’s that’s it’s kind of cows that I like. And they are behaving very well because here where I’m at, So hot.

I mean, in summary, just and then you have have a mixture of a a hundred and ten degrees, hundred and fifty degrees. DIRTT is kind of like white. It’s white. Oh, yeah. So, I mean, it it reflects so much. So so it gets very, very hot. Which is so true.

We, you know, we always go back to last or philosophy of calories. And I’m not sure if you’re familiar with it, but — Of course. — he always said, you know, that cows get ween a calf every year, and I don’t care why she doesn’t. But because if she doesn’t, she’s not going to be here. In fact, we’ve got some family members that raise cattle too, but they they raise them on a little bit different or different philosophy than we are. Okay. In fact, they had a a cow cab other day that had lost her calf last year. And I thought, oh, she just looks so good. We’ll we’ll give her a second chance. She lost her cats this year. Oh, in our book, they get one shot And if they mess it up, we’re going to send them somewhere else because they’re not working for our management.

And that’s a big thing Lassiter says in his book, which I love his book. I I read it quite often. It’s a real quick read, but it’s a really good one, and that’s one of those important things. You’re totally right. And you know what? I love that book as well.

And by you saying about selection, when he talks about selection, he says, nobody’s gonna appear what color of cow was when it’s on the plate. Yes. I mean, yes. I mean, he goes about productivity, about selection, and and and I think that’s the way to go. Yes.

So I’m I’m kinda interested in the Moshona. We do not have very many Moshona cattle in my area. Now I was looking at a farmer ranch that’s not too far from me and they have started using some persona balls. Okay. So I’m I’m hoping to go visit them at some point so I can see them. I’ve read a little bit about machona, but I’ve never seen one in person, nor have we used one obviously. It looked much like an angle. But the angle has, like, more, like, thicker bone. Like like like Oh, yes. Like like thicker? The other one has thinner bone and a muscular as well and very rustic. So we’ve said, I mean, for for the weather and everything. And and supposedly the the cows are more fertile. I’m I’m happy with them right now. And I’m happy with the color that I have since inception because I’m selecting.

So the ones that are there because they are delivering me a calvary Oh, yes. Yeah. And and you know what I did last year? I brought in because you see, when I started to see that my ranch had more capacity. That’s okay. So I need to bring more cows in. So I brought Coriant cows.

Or rodeo. Oh, yes. Yes. Oh, those are great. Let me tell you. Mid sized they have body condition. I mean, they have very good body condition. And and when they deliver you, cow. From a angus or a air force or in me or in my case a half and half with the persona, cannot help. The mama is a rodeo. It’s amazing.

We’ve had a few guests still in our podcast that’s really sung the praises of Korean taste. And you know what? I like ropeing. I’m a header. So I love Corona. Oh, yes. Brie. So so actually sometimes I use them and then after a while, I just You can do a ranch and then prepacks. Oh, yes. Yeah. That works out good. It it works good.

But now the main reason to have them, those Korean, the ones, is to send them to Iran to operating. And that they’re very good. And they’re very good mamas as well. They take care of their curls very well or is this a good way? So when you win your calves, how are you marketing them? I export them to the US basically. I I sell them sometimes I sell them here into Huawei. It depends on how the prices. If the price is better in the the border, we usually export through the Santa Teresa border. You see, we’re right on the border with Texas and New Mexico most of the cattle that that is being sold, it goes to the US. Some states here, some goes to the US.

What I wanted to do now is I wanna stir you see, talking about lacer and about cattle registration, I go more by how productive the catalyst. More if he has papers, more if he’s who’s a mother, who’s a father. And I don’t go about that. And so so what I’m trying to do is the like, the pools that I got, they are from a guy that started rating persona like five or six years ago, saw his polar bear. The first ones I got from him, then I did in artificial examination — Oh, yes. — of my cows with some of the with some very good machina hundred percent bulls. So when I started to get my own my my own bulls. So what I wanted to do as well is getting some getting the market to know my bull that they are very fertile and and ready to work on hot and dry environments. And you know what? It’s very different color.

When you go and buy a boohoo, when you go and buy it in a corral, when he’s fitting with, hey, it’s beautiful. I mean, it just Oh, yeah. It just can help to fall in love with it. But when you take it out of It comes. Like they said, with a working clothes, let’s see how he — Yes. — historic — Yes. — historic — Yes. — so I wanna sell Goodballs with working clothes are not with now we are tuxedo one with working clothes. Right. Yes.

I’ll be here before we get to the over grazing section, and we’re gonna talk about we’re gonna take a deeper dive into high density grazing. But before we go there, when you’re looking at the future and I know you’ve you’ve mentioned this a little bit and we’ll talk more about it in the high density. But what are some of your goals for the farm besides your stocking rate? What are some other goes? Carbon credit? For sure. So actually, let’s talk about those carbon credits just a little bit.

I’m not familiar with the system you’re using there, or I don’t believe I am. Oh, alright. So it is getting more flows of income of your ratchet with the same thing that you do. So when you start to work with high density grazing, obviously, like, we about your regenerate, so you have more tuck in rate. And I wanna go five hundred calories, and I will.

And but at at the same token, once you’ve got more grass on your land and you generate more more foot synthesis. That’s when you capture carbon from the atmosphere and bring it into the ground as carbohydrates. Those two things. It brings nutrients to the ground, the roots. Yes. So so you nurture your ground. But at this token, you are helping the global warming. Could you see what the thing that that warms up the atmosphere is the amount of carbon that is on the atmosphere and the plants that we have are not able to capture the photosynthesis to bring it inside. So the more the more photosynthesis we can create within our grasslands, the more carbon we capture And then there’s companies that they release a lot of carbon into the atmosphere, so they need to compensate. So a few compensate with your grassland and you capture those carbon credits, those carved that carbon then you get carbon crease and they pay you. So that’s an another flow of income to your range just by doing what you’re supposed to do or generate your land.

So we’re in the process here in Chihuahua. There’s, like, twenty five wrenches that we’re working on that right now. And that we’re in the process of get we already got certified and the process of getting I mean, the money really is just in the process to get some money because See what happened? They have a satellite. It’s very it’s very interesting car. They have a satellite. So you give them your Yeah. Your coordinates. So they go through the satellite and they say, okay. This coordinates they capture for the last five is is much carbon from the animal cell. Okay? So that ranch, we can pay them is much per acre because of how much carbon it is captured. So the more grass you have, the more photosynthesis you create, The more you get So it’s a win win win or will they?

Yes, it is. I I I agree. Is it so the amount you get paid will they’re looking at it and paying it on the past. So you so a year from now, they’ll look back at the last year, or how do they do it going forward? And they’re gonna go year by year. First, they’re gonna go five years prior, and then they’re gonna go year by year. That’s that’s the way it’s gonna work. No. That’s the way it’s gonna My rant at the beginning, it’s old. It was so bad that it’s old. Yes. And now I have paid everything that I owe. And now I mean, I mean, good numbers. Let’s put it that way.

So when I just think about it, Cal, it’s if the satellite of the carbon has detected that the wrenches that we do the high density crazy, we capture more carbon from the from the atmosphere to see magic what’s doing to your land. I mean, all the carbohydrates are going to the ground. He’s just nurturing it. Oh, awesome. That just by doing that, you said, men, my ratche is gonna be way better. And you know what? That’s that’s something interesting.

One day I got a call. And they said, you know, there’s a ranch right by right by your ranch. That it’s seven thousand it’s like sixteen thousand acres. And you can About four hundred cap is great. Message it. Come on. I’m gonna get five hundred in three thousand. So so imagine what the value what value gives to your land Just by saying, if I were to sell my ranch right now, we’ll sell it as a three thousand acre ranch or there’s a six thousand acre ranch. Because he has the capacity to carry way more to Oh, yes. I mean, it’s cash flow. It’s cash flow. It seems about Oh, yes. Yeah. It is. Yes.

Well, Javier, it is time for us to transition to the overgrazing section. As we mentioned a while ago, For the overgrazing section, we’re gonna talk about high density grazing. And you mentioned earlier you were grazing a hundred and twenty five cattle per acre. Right. That’s correct. And the way how you measure that cow is, let’s say, if you had a hundred cows in one acreage, the density is a hundred to one. So and the higher you go, the more you regenerate your graphics. It’s it’s very simple. It’s very simple. The closer you have your cattle.

Two things happen. They are not able to gray selectively. Just imagine if we go to a buffet, and it’s just you and me and there’s tons of stuff. We will select what we But if there’s hundred more people going, we’ll take whatever we can. Nothing will get rotten because if we select, then what we don’t select is gonna start go old. It’s gonna run and it’s gonna go bad. So that’s exactly what happens.

Carol comes in on a non selective way at high density. So they as they walk, they they never you can see them how they walk, they they go back and forth, and then two more things happen, the hoof. They are breaking the capping of the ground. So it is better for the land. The saliva helps for the bigger of the plant. The urine, it helps for the is nutrients for the ground. And the dung, which is so amazing the dung. It’s just put for the gram. So this cow is an amazing regenerating machine. So when we do this type of grazing, they just they are close to each other. They are making all the disturbion on the ground. They break the capping. So what happens then? And then they nurture with all the things that we talked about.

So when water from the when the rainfall comes in, it doesn’t it doesn’t run as far fast because now the cap in is broken, so it starts to go in. Absolutely. You know, Lord, but Yeah. And and you know, we we can go to something else. Like, I never use the verb time for my cows because it will kill the beetle, it will kill, the termite, it will kill the ant, all those guys that go in there and work with a dong with a manure and into the ground.

I think it’s I think that said it’s the strongest animal in the world. Because the way they rolled the dung, the dog ball? And — Yes. — so the dung made a bunch of it. How many holes do you get when you have enough so when water goes through, it goes into the hole. And then what the beetle doesn’t need then the termite comes and gets it. Almost of the termite is fertilizer as well for the ground. So when you their nature work by itself and help them up. It is amazing. It is amazing what happens. Also, one kilogram or two point two pounds of dung have the capability to capture twenty liters of rain water. So imagine what you do to your land when you get all that dung spread all over. Oh, yeah. I mean So it’s it’s like it’s like they said, it’s not how much it raises, how much you capture from the rain. Right? Yes. So so it’s important that it rains enough, but it’s also very important that whatever comes down to your to your right, to your grassland, you capture the most you can. When you get more moisture, in the cycle, the whole cycle just goes on and on and on.

Now you mentioned while ago a hundred and twenty five cattle to the acre. Is that what your target is? Or is that fluctuating something? You know what? I’m gonna stay there for a while. Because as I mentioned, I went to almost three hundred caliber per acre. And that was too much. That was twelve changes a day.

You see what happens is the system to be very careful that your cow, the woman of your cow always has to be full. You’re gonna start not one minute. So if you don’t make the changes on time, then your cow starts to get you starve them. And if your cow is not full, the whole the embodied condition starts to go down. Any body condition goes down, you will not have a calf at the end of the year. That’s very important. So that’s why I said, okay. What is a good starting point is forty forty cattle per acre to start regenerating. And from then up, It’s it’s awesome. So I’m I’m starting I I’m staying at one twenty five one twenty five per acre. Very good, Javier. Excellent description and explaining that and where you are going to transition to our famous four question Okay. Same four questions. We asked of all of our guests. Alright. Our very first question.

What is your favorite grazing grass related book or resource. There’s a book. I don’t know if you’re familiar with Johan Sismet. And he wrote a book that is called Man Karen and Belle. Oh, yes. Okay. So that that’s a book that I have in Spanish and English and is audiobook and physical book. It’s amazing. I just love I read it and read it and read I purchased that book not too long ago, but as fans of the podcast will know, I my to read list is quite long. But it’s on my stack to read. I just haven’t got there yet.

Has a lot of knowledge and in a very simple way. I I like things simple because what you know what? It’s too hard, then you don’t do it, or you don’t understand it. And that’s what happened when when I brought people to the ranch, cow? When they say, is that how you do it? Yeah. That’s it. Oh. You you usually like that. It is. But there’s a lot of people think so hard in this scenario. It’s just about a discipline of doing it every day and continuously doing and never never quit. Just keep doing it because it pays and it pays out very well. Oh, yes. Very good.

Our second question, what is your favorite tool on the ranch? Or what tool could you not live without? Oh, the electric fence. Without the electric fence, there’s no way that I couldn’t have ninety pallets right now and break him to twelve hundred pallets. So, yeah, I I think that’s the main that’s the main tool. It’s funny because horses I think horses will use them like five percent of the time. We usually go walking. We go with a quad bike. That’s it. Horse is very seldom no worries. Just what you gather, when we have to change him, like, if we’re gonna work him, like, decide that we’re gonna work, we’re gonna work him, and we need to change him from one pasture that we’re far from the corral. Change into a graph? That’s when you use horses. But beyond that, we never use it. Oh, yeah.

Our third question is, what advice would you give to someone just getting started? Patience. Patience. Patience. Patience is a good one. Yes. Because we are used, you know, on this time of our of our era that we’re living, we don’t have any more pitch. We want everything to be fast. We want everything to be immediately. And when you’re talking about land, when you’re talking about the ground, the soil, is is not that fast. But if you have the patience to continue to do it, to grace at high density, to change your your cattle as many times as you can or you want, you will results. And they told me once, they said that they my adviser at the right, they said, Okay. Alright.

Let’s let’s put it this way. Let’s say that you wanna you wanna cook a meal and you have all your ingredients all chopped up and everything you put in your pan, put the oil on, you don’t have any gas in your stove. So the gas in your stove is like the rain. You might be working on your pasture, on your paddocks, and then there was a very seldom rain, and you see some changes, but not as much. So even I said, oh, man, this thing doesn’t work. Forget it. Let’s go to over. Let’s go to selective racing again. This just thing doesn’t pay up. No. It will pay up. You just need one good rain and you will see the difference. It’s amazing. So patience patience patience because it works and it pays off very good. And I’m not sure we’ve had patience suggested before, but I I fully support it. I mean, It takes time. And you gotta have patience to to follow through and to get to start seeing some of those results. And maybe that’s something I need to work on because I need to diet, but I don’t see any results yet, so I’m not being patient enough. But that’s another topic.

Havier, where can others find out more about you? Well, I have on social media, I have Don Pacheen Grayson Don’t the chili. It goes under my father because they used to call him, don’t the chin. And Oh, wait. So that’s that’s the name that I that I put to the to the ranch. So don’t the chin racing? I mean Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, and Linkedin. So there you can see you can see a lot of pictures, how the ranch was, how things are moving along. Actually, these people that ask me questions there, so I get a answer so we can have communication through there. Very good. And we’ll put links to your media accounts and your web site? On our show notes. Okay.

And Javier, we thank you for coming on and sharing with us today. Well, Kjell, thank you very much for the invitation. I’m very happy to share this information with a with your audience because you know what? I love cattle. I love cattle ranching. And I just love when cattle ranchers do good. And the real good. The bad things right now is that we’re not doing good because there’s more there’s less rainfall, less grass on the ranges. So So Ranchers, we are really struggling. So we’re part of them. And now that I’m seeing it work in my ranch, I want to share it. Because it works. And we had to become profitable again on the rent. Exactly. Yes.

You’re listening to the grazing grass podcast, helping grass farmers learn from grass farmers, and every episode features a grass farmer and their operation. I’ve enjoyed today’s conversation. Hope you’ve enjoyed it as well. If you would like to continue on the conversation, Visit the grazinggrass community at community dot grazinggrass dot com or go to the grazinggrass dot com and click on the community link. You can find the Gras podcast on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and YouTube. So if you haven’t subscribed to us on YouTube, we encourage you to go over and subscribe scribe. We will be releasing episodes over there. We also have a lot of episodes we haven’t released that we’re gonna get over there as well. If you find something valuable, please share it. We appreciate you sharing about our podcast and getting the word out. Are you a grass farmer? Would you be interested in sharing about your journey? If so, go to gracing grass dot com and click on Be our guest. There’s a short form you fill out, and we’ll be in touch. Until next time, keep on grazing grass.

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